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Fri Nov 17, 2006 8:12 pm

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:? Recovery Time ?? Is their a bench mark , lift weights twice a week and maybe throw hard only once a week? I feel no mater how much time I have between workouts, I still feel like I was hammered in my sleep . I am 55 + and trying to learn the Discus & Javelin again after 30 years. I know conditioning takes time but I dont have a clue .



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Sat Nov 18, 2006 12:01 am

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Location: Chico, CA

My comments refer to the discus. I threw the javelin in college but am not brave enough to attempt it as a masters. These methods work for me but may not be appropriate for all old throwers.

With a 30 year layoff it takes about 3-years of continuous training before you can lift and throw regularly without feeling like a truck ran over you. I started throwing again at age 45 but didn't compete in masters meets until age 50 (I threw in about 8 open meets a year before age 50).

At first my body hurt so much that it was sometimes difficult to pick up the discus. I would come home after a workout and fall asleep in a chair— then hurt for two days. Gradually, my body stopped hurting so badly. At age 59 I can train 5-6 days a week and feel reasonably good. Here are a few suggestions that worked for me:

• I suggest training 12-months a year. Masters invariably get injured when they begin heavy training after a 2-3 month layoff. Even throwing only once a week, lifting 2 days a week, aerobics 3 days per week will keep you in good throwing shape and prevent injury.

• Avoid monster training sessions. Do everything gradually. Do plenty of drills with powerballs and learn to make smooth, balanced turns. You can do hundreds of turns in your garage or on the track and don't need to throw that much. Throw the discus and work on specific problem. Do drills.

• Injuries reflect training errors. Train within your capacity. As Dirty Harry said, "A man gots to know his limitations."

• Learn to throw with your body, turn your feet, and apply force segmentally. The arm is the last segment to apply force in the discus— not the first. Watch the movement of great golfers and martial artists. The great ones lead with their legs and hips and then finish with the abs, shoulders, and then the arm.

• Emphasize function strength training. I was a competitive powerlifter in the late 60s and early 70s. I was able to bench press 390 at age 54 but my shoulders hurt so much that it hurt to warm-up at 135. Now, I train on a LifeFitness Functional training machine (all exercises done from a standing position) and do Olympic lifts with a bumper plate set. Exercises I like include the Bergener warm-up, front squats, full snatches, power snatches, overhead squats, jerks off the rack, thrusters with bar or dumbbells. My major joints and back feel good.

• Do whole body overload exercises. Good exercises include large rock exercises (30 to 100 pounds), such as overhead and underhand throws and two arm side throws, harness or sled pulling, car pushing, farmers bars, and combinations (rock running plus farmers bar; rock plus pack, etc.)

• Do some plyometrics as tolerated.

• Include aerobics. I made the mistake of doing only sprints, and I think it negatively affected my health. I have been using a Cybex Elliptical trainer: it builds leg power and endurance. I find the improved endurance gives me better staying power during throwing workouts. Walking is also good for old big guys.

• Watch plenty of film and film your workouts regularly. Try to throw further with less effort.

• Forget about how far you threw in the old days. Try to throw further than you do today. Also, don't worry about other throwers. If you work hard and prepare well you will perform well.

• Be happy you're out there. Everytime I compete— particularly against college athletes— I marvel that I still get the chance to play this magnificent sport.

• Throw in the big meets. I love throwing in the Nationals and World Championships. It is a great thrill. There are no qualifying marks, so show up and do your best. There are plenty of great places to throw in the USA for masters: UC San Diego, UC Irvine, Santa Barbara, Eugene, Sac State, Modesto, Phoenix (Tim Muller), Texas (Bob Ward), and New England (Carl Wallin)— to name a few. Also, many open meets will let you throw against the college kids (have to throw the 2 kg discus). One of my greatest thrills was overhearing a kid say, "I can't believe that old fart beat me."

Tom Fahey M59, thrower



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Sat Nov 18, 2006 9:27 am

 
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Joined: Thu Sep 07, 2006 8:03 pm
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Tom, What are your favorite resourses for learning the spin? Is there a certain book or video you really like that you could recommend? Thank you!



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Sat Nov 18, 2006 2:36 pm

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Joined: Thu Sep 07, 2006 2:01 pm
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Location: Chico, CA

John Powell sells an an excellent DVD on his website ( www.discususa.com ). The Olympic development site ( www.track-tech.com/tapes.htm ) has excellent material at a very reasonable cost.

Dan John has published a free book on discus throwing available on his wonderful website: www.DanJohn.org.

Tom Fahey M(59) thrower



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Sat Nov 18, 2006 8:30 pm

 
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Joined: Fri Nov 17, 2006 7:56 pm
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:lol: :D Thank's for the info . Any thoughts on throwing a 10 lb. weight like its a discus ? Can this help in building strength , or will this just slow you down as far as trying to develope speed for the spin ? Im just trying to figure out more bang for the buck with a limited amount of time to train. Hopefully in the near future I can retire from my current job and have more time to train properly. thank's again for the feedback...................



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Sun Nov 19, 2006 8:31 am

 
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Tom, Thanks for the response. The DanJohn site is wonderful and the book is great at explaining the technical stuff in an easy to visualize way.



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Sun Nov 19, 2006 3:53 pm

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Location: Chico, CA

I taught a strength and power course at UCLA a few weeks ago. One student was the former world champion in long-ball driving (golf). She trained with heavy balls to improve core fitness and explosiveness. She really emphasized turning the right foot and hips— the way we do in throwing.

Throwing the weight properly will train you to use your legs, hips, abs, and shoulder rather than your arm. Also, it will teach you to apply force to the ball gradually. Learn to pendulate the ball and the discus, so you don't have to work so hard.

I bought a 30 pound stone from a company called Atomic. Throwing it also contributes to functional power. However, the ball is very hard on the grass. I throw it at the university when the grounds guys aren't around.

Tom Fahey M59 Thrower



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