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Wed Apr 04, 2007 4:57 pm

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Senior Masters Athlete
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After years of intermittent and increasingly bad back troubles, my wife signed me up with a personal trainer, from whom I faithfully receive torture 3 days a week, and run on my own another 3x/wk. Have dropped from 22.5% body fat to 14% (last I checked) in about three months. Started thinking about a goal to pursue to keep it interesting, and of course I started wondering whether I could do anything even close to my PR from my HS days (1:59).....24 years later. Fortuitously, my trainer's wife is a former D-1 college 400m runner and now a trainer herself, so as soon as I got up the nerve to mention this, he started putting together a program. Previously we alternated upper body with lower body/core, but now on leg days (at least 1x/wk) we're outside doing intervals. Last week I did a short but very intense 3x300, 5m rest, at 39, 38.7, 39.8, after which I was completely toast. The fact I still have native speed is encouraging, but even back in the day I was not very good at base building, and the 2m-3m threshold runs outside on hilly trails feel awful. Aside from weight training and interval sessions, I've been getting in 10m/wk, not much but I go hard. I have two months until a six-week series of all-comers meets, and now I'm wondering.....should I just drop down to the 400? Any suggestions on the best way to get 800m ready in the time I have left?



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Thu Apr 05, 2007 6:03 am

 
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Master Masters Athlete
Joined: Tue Mar 27, 2007 10:57 am
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Location: Huntsville, AL

Just hang in there. Its going to be tough after not training for so long. Once you get over the hump you will be just fine. With the training your doing at the moment appears to be more of a 400m runner workout. So if you going to continue to train in that direction then yep the 400m is where you should be. It will be very difficult going from 300m workouts to a competition 800m race. Keep up the hard work and remember your doing it for fun and good health.

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Thu Apr 05, 2007 7:48 am

 
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Senior Masters Athlete
Joined: Wed Apr 04, 2007 4:44 pm
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Exactly my thoughts...this IS fun. The interesting (but not terribly surprising) thing is how much more attention we pay to our bodies and what we're doing to them at 40+ than we did as teenagers. I used to give my own father grief about his wheat germ and vitamin regimen, and now I cringe at what my 14 year old daughter eats.

Doing some 600s on Friday, which should be revealing.

Thanks for the encouragement!



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Thu Apr 05, 2007 9:09 am

 
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Junior Masters Athlete
Joined: Fri Mar 30, 2007 2:44 pm
Posts: 3
Location: Arlington, Texas

At 54 I'm in a similar sitution, I thought I was a middle distance runner
in the high school era, but now I would kind of like to see what I could
do 400 meters in. My goal is a 60 by the age 60. I have been working on
getting back in good overall shape for the last 3 years.
Two things are most important to me now:
1)Carry as little weight as possible
2)No matter what- don't get injured.

My gut feel is that I may be able to attain a 60 400 alot quicker once
I get to my idea weight.

I'm still experimenting to figure out how much high intensity work and
how often I can take it AND loose weight to what I think my ideal weight
level is.

Specifically what I do for workouts right now isn't as important...mix it up and keep it from being boring.

Don't forget to lift some weights...I had back problems periodically but
lifting weights has really cured that...especially doing deadlifts.
That is another goal I have....a 500 lb deadlift by 60



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Thu Apr 05, 2007 10:54 am

 
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Master Masters Athlete
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Joined: Sun Feb 18, 2007 7:21 pm
Posts: 134
Location: NW Oregon

Have fun in the meets, experiment, try the 400, but also try the 1500 (or mile) as well as the 800.
Though you might set a goal time for the 800m, you might focus more on the effort you put forth in each race, making sure that you gave it your best effort for 100% of the race. (no rope-a-dope in the middle of the race).
If you can develop the speed of the 400 meter runner, plus the endurance of the 1500 meter runner you have a chance to run a decent 800.
My goal in the 800 when I turned 40 was to break 2:00, but I also have a bad lower back, and because of it, it referred pain to my calf, and caused a strain. That totally set back my training and I ended up only running a 2:05, but I was happy with that because I gave it my best effort through out the whole race. But that race went way to fast, I had no time to react, therefore I hope to run the 1500 when I turn 50 next year, at least there is time to recover from a tactical mistake and still get back into contention before the race is finished.
I would focus on running "speed" workouts - repeat 200's and 300's, but also run "speed endurance" workouts which could be things like ladder (or breakdown) workouts with negative splits - 1200 - 800 - 400 - 200.
Each split will have a faster pace until you are at 90 - 100 % at the 200m.
If you do two speed workouts a week, I would put the speed endurance workout first and then the speed. Once the meets start, cut that down to just running the meet and then one "speed" workout, or no speed workout, just race the meet once a week.
Also if you want to run a good 800, I would recommend to race the 1500 and 400 together in the first few meets and then move down to the 800 alone for the last few meets. This would help your endurance to be able to run those two laps at a fairly consistent pace. I figure that you would run the 2nd lap around 2 seconds slower than the first, so to break 2:00 you would need to run around a 58 for the first lap and come back with a 60 the second. So you might want to plan you workouts with those times in mind.



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Fri Apr 06, 2007 3:57 pm

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Senior Masters Athlete
Joined: Wed Apr 04, 2007 4:44 pm
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Well, the planned 600 workout was, shall we say, a good indicator. I need miles, many more miles. After a 1:50 first 600, which felt OK but not great, I ended up stepping off at 400 on the second try, at 74. Baaaaaad lungs. Did a 400 in 72, then decided to ladder down but hit a wall, 300 in 60 (ugh), then 200 in 34, 100 in 14. Oddly enough, my quads feel worst in the aftermath. I think it's related to mechanics; I've been trying to increase my stride length. Anyway, I'm thinking I just need to find the time to get more mileage in.

Today was discouraging in a way, but also a good measure and hard work, which means improvement. Tomorrow is a new day.



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Fri Apr 06, 2007 6:57 pm

 
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Junior Masters Athlete
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Joined: Tue Sep 12, 2006 10:40 pm
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Don't be discouraged. We have bad and good days. Our bodies just don't respond the same anymore. Look at the positive, you have a baseline to work from and you have pinpointed what you need to develop. Put in some miles and come back and try the workout again. Remember don't compare the past glory days to now. There just isn't a comparison to be made.



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Sat Apr 07, 2007 2:57 pm

 
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Joined: Sun Feb 18, 2007 7:21 pm
Posts: 134
Location: NW Oregon

You might consider the book "Coach Benson's 'Secret' Workouts".
It is about effort-based training.
In the book, he covers the different stages of training and explains what each does to our endurance and running (racing) form.
He tells how to use a heart rate monitor to test the effort you are putting forth.
If you do want to get a heart rate monitor. I recommend either ebay, or the Big 5 stores, watch the ads, they usually have good quality ones at a cheap price.
Have patience in your workouts, you know where you are now, and can build from there, we all have to start somewhere.
Heck I am only up to a 40 minute run today at a 9:30 pace, but I hope to run a sub 5:00 mile when I turn 50 next year. I plan to build a long base phase before I get into speed workouts.
Good luck in your training.



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Sun Apr 15, 2007 11:47 am

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Senior Masters Athlete
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Joined: Sun Feb 04, 2007 9:56 am
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Location: Montgomery County , Md

Why do we have this penchant for speed , when a casual jog would be much less precarious ?? Sites have been formed for the likes of these. Keep it fun and varied - and listen closely to what your body tells you on a daily basis. Dream big and press the envelope when the mood strikes. Happy trails !



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Mon May 07, 2007 4:30 pm

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Senior Masters Athlete
Joined: Wed Apr 04, 2007 4:44 pm
Posts: 12

Training goes apace (and I bought my first spikes in 24 years yesterday). However, as I figure out my "old and improved" body, I'm pretty convinced I'll shift down an event for the most part. The 400 seems most manageable in conjunction with real life. So, my interval training is a little shorter, a little faster. This is not to say I won't try an 800 or two. My body's just not built for it anymore. I'll probably try a few 200s as well -- something I NEVER raced as a youngster.

The best part of this adventure so far: my 9-year-old daughter has decided she wants to try out the track meets with me.



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