1. David E. Ortman (M56) Seattle, WA - August 13, 2009

   At the risk of repeating myself in a recent previous post, the National Senior Games sprint schedule at Palo Alto was simple ridiculous and failed to reflect any consideration for masters/seniors sprinters. When I looked at the schedule below, I could not envision how even a great M55 sprinter such as Bill Collins could cover the 100/200/400 in the limited time allotted.
   Here is NSG 2009 schedule in Palo Alto for M55 100m, 200m, and 400m. Within the space of four hours and during the hottest time of the day:
   M55-59 – August 10th
   1:15 PM 200m (60) Quarters
   2:40 PM 400m (16) Semi
   3:25 PM 100m (8) FINALS
   4:25 PM 200m (16) Semi
   5:20 PM 400m (8) FINALS
   This is not an acceptable schedule for a high school, college or open meet. After a 400m, 2x200m and a 100m, how does NSG expect masters (senior) sprinters to run a 400m Final all in the same afternoon?
   Perspiring minds want to know.

2. Craig Davis - August 14, 2009

   I would agree that any sprinter especially 45 and up would have great difficulty in full recovery to compete at the highest level based on time line provide. We are not college students any more and the stress on the muscle to endure just one serious of 100 FINAL (you can not hold back), 400 and 200 at 100% is quite a feat. Adding another 200 and a 400 final is a ton.
   I can not be super critical of Bill for not running such a schedule. The strain on youner legs would be extreme and for us masters to endure such a schedule is Xtreme.

3. Anonymous - August 14, 2009

   I can assure you that knowing Mr. Collins as I do, he has not been ducking any races. I am sure it makes for good “blog copy” though, and it keeps the talk going. Its like Gay and Bolt, Collins and Peyton, its all good! Mr. Collins has enough wins and records which speak to his ability to perform. I believe he has the right as much as anyone else to decide what, when and where he wants to run. Here is a good rumor for the blog. Its been reported that Mr. Collins has run 11.2 in practice this year….

4. Mary Harada - August 14, 2009

   A look at the schedule for m/w 65 and up for track events shows an utter disregard for the concept of recovery. Perhaps those who put together these schedules believe that folks specialize in one or two events. This is most often not the case
   Day 2 has the 1500m run for all ages from 10 am onward. At noon the 100 meter races begin. and at 2:30 the 400 meter races – mostly qualifying rounds but for the oldest competitors – the finals
   Day 3 Starts with the 800m finals or semifinals starting at 10 am. At noon the 200m finals/semis are run. and at 1:30 the 400 m finals.
   Day 4 begins with the 200m finals with the men in the 60’s running a semi- at 10 am and a final 2 hours later. and then has the remaining 800m finals for W 65-69, and M 65-69 and 70-74 – those who ran a semi-final and qualified the prior day. These start at 1 pm.
   As strange as it may seem to some who probably do not run – there are those who run the 400 and the 800 and there are those who may want to run the 1500 and the 400. There are many who run the 200 and the 400. And believe it or not there are competitors who hope to perform at their best at a national meet. However being asked to do a double is difficult for most of us – and especially hard for older athletes. When I took a look at this schedule earlier in the summer I was glad I had decide to compete in Lahti rather than the NSG.
   Who makes up these schedules? And why has the NSG decided to cram all the running events into 3 days? Day 1 is field events – no running events at all. This is a schedule worthy of an all-comers meet.

5. anonymous - August 14, 2009

   Poor schedule or not.I WOULD HAVE SKIPPED THE 400 AND GO UP AGAINST OSCAR,WHO IS RANKED AHEAD OF ME.Then we would know WHO IS THE MAN IN THE 55-59

6. Anonymous - August 14, 2009

   I KNOW who the man is

7. Keith Mathis - August 14, 2009

   Oscar would definitely win in a three way race in the 100M. People should just admit it Bill had his run and is a great sprinter and rules in the 400M but in the 100M and 200M my friend Oscar Peyton (Maryland’s own) is now the man!!! Oscar himself left a comment but it was so fast it could not be read by the human eye!!! When Superman stepped up to the line and saw Oscar in the blocks he just pulled his cape up around his face and walked away shaking his head- at least he retired undefeated.
   Keith Mathis

8. anonymous - August 14, 2009

   Just look-up British runner Stephen 1 and 2,and with those times he cannot touch Bill.What Bill need to do ,Is call Oacar up pay his ticket to Australia,race him before he leaves the 55-59 group and then WE WILL CALL HIM THE “MAN”

9. Kenneth Effler - August 14, 2009

   At our age you have to pick and choose your times to compete. Minor injuries are more frequent, and can lead to major setbacks if you try to compete through them.
   Bill or Oscar, Oscar or Bill…they both set extremely high standards for the rest of us, and also for those in the younger age groups. I enjoy watching both of them compete whether it is head to head, or not.

10. Anonymous - August 14, 2009

    Agree with you BRO.Ali box Kenny Norton 12 rounds with broken hand

11. Rick Riddle - August 14, 2009

    I call Bill my friend, and I care about him as I would care about a brother. I have spent entire track meets, foreign and domestic, in his company. In that time I have learned that the grace and dignity with which Bill conducts himself in public is not an act or a mask. It is genuine. It is as real as the sun’s return each morning.
    This is the lesson in life’s navigation that ‘anonymous’ detractors have failed to acquire. Bill Collins would NEVER write an anonymous email or blog comment deriding the efforts of a fellow track athlete. Not on his death bed, in an uncharacteristic fit of anger, would the thought cross his mind.
    For the record, Bill was bed ridden with the flu after returning home from Oshkosh and wasn’t able to train prior to the Palo Alto meet. He suffered bouts of coughing before he even went to the start line in his races in Palo Alto. He would never let you in on that circumstance, so Ken, I feel compelled to share that fact with your readers. Most of us, in his situation, would not have even tried to compete. This is the mark of a true champion; the will to appear, race, and not make a single excuse; even though he knew he was physically drained.
    I made the mistake of trying to run the 100 m final, thirty minutes after running a 400 m semi-final. It was a disaster. Does that make me courageous? No, it makes me short on common sense, a mistake that Bill did not make. Never forget you are talking about someone who has raced around the world in elite track meets since he was 21 years old. Mistakes in race selection, by the savvy veteran, are rare. As others have mentioned, the sprint schedule at Palo Alto was assembled in a runner-unfriendly manner, as profound an understatement as I can manage, stretching respectfulness to its full length.
    There will always be those that are jealous of a great athlete’s accomplishment. Too often, they express themselves in negativity, a negativity that is ill camouflage for smoldering envy and smallness. We heartily applaud the less talented athlete, placing our arms around them (as we should) when they compete and meet or exceed their expectations, yet afford not a single shred of this same decency to those that achieve what we all wish to own. Why is this? It’s a question deserving of answer. I suggest the answer is embedded in personal jealousy or personal advancement of agenda.
    For those ‘anonymous’ that weave black words of hatred I suggest reconsideration of your position and your motive. Wading, by choice, into the fecal infested waters of group negativity and ‘anonymity’ places you not in an admirable position, but merely leaves you knee deep in putrid waters, ducking your head, wishing that no one will see you mired there.
    Lost in this discussion is the outstanding achievement of Oscar Peyton, the remarkable athletic displays of Charles Allie who won all 3 sprints in M60-64 under ridiculous scheduling conditions. Lost are the kind and supportive words spoken to me by my fellow competitors, Neil Steinberg and Greg Pizza. Lost, is an eye-opening 800 meter run by Horace Grant.
    The need for anonymity when we speak to one another is a dangerous signal. It’s much like a yellow caution light at an intersection. It means slow down and look both ways before speaking. And perhaps it suggests a return to civility?

12. Panama Kid - August 14, 2009

    Nice COMENTARIOS Rick,Thanks for your help when I call upon you with my NUMEROUS e-mails and calls.Be advised,I got more of the same with two more meets left in the year.

13. Stefan Waltermann - August 14, 2009

    Wait a minute! I think we all noted both, Oscar & Bill in the ill-fated 100 m finals in Oshkosh just a few weeks ago. I talked to Oscar at breakfast on the morning of the race. He was as motivated as I’ve ever seen a man, ready to take on the world, ready to take on Bill. He openly talks about wanting to beat the MAN (Bill), it gets him up in the morning and helps him to focus in training. What a wonderful thing it is to have a friendly rivalry that gives you that much motivation. All the rest is just mean spirited speculation and unworthy of two of the greatest sprinters in masters track. Oscar wrote right after Oshkosh: “Thirdly, about Bill; I truly believe that he has no fear. He’s not 100 percent healthy and I am close to 100 percent. He is simply doing what a lot of us do, gauge your health and compete accordingly. Those races that he chose to run does not require the physical demand that it will take on his injury if he was in a race against me. As soon as he feels that he is well enough, it will be on.” In Bill & Oscar we have two very humble man who are thankful that they have each other to compete.

14. Rick Riddle - August 14, 2009

    And your name is?

15. Anonymous - August 14, 2009

    When are YOU racing again,I will introduce myself to you “bubba”

16. Burr Daly - August 14, 2009

    Mr Stone – I believe it’s time to change your ground rules. No actual name – no comment accepted. Any one agree?

17. Roger Parnell - August 14, 2009

    I also competed at Palo Alto. I was fortunate enough to get off a decent long jump before straining my groin on my third attempt. Like Bill, I had to make a decision on just how many rounds I could tolerate given my injury. I opted out of the 200 in order to insure that I could run in the 100M finals. Based on my performance and place in that race, it was a very good decision on my part. Gratefully, my motivations were not questioned by others. Like me, I am sure that Bill was trying to dodge and injury and not a fellow competitor. Smart move on his part.

18. mike walker - August 14, 2009

    While it would be fun to see the best runners compete against each other at every big meet, everyone has different motivations and reasons for competing or not and with a very few exceptions we all have to pay our own way and take time off from work, family, etc to be at the meets.

19. Anonymous - August 14, 2009

    HEY FELLOWS,YOU DON’T SKIP YOUR MAIN COMPETITOR.Case closed.NONE OF US SCRATCH FROM MEETS/HEATS IF WE SEE A BARNWELL,OSCAR,BILL,ALLIE.LIDA OR GRANT knowing WE ARE NOT GOING TO BEAT THEM while we are AWAKE.Bill took a powder,the prelims was a MIRAGE.OSCAR IS THE “MAN”.Savour it Mr.Collins,you will see Oscar in three years.

20. Panama Kid - August 14, 2009

    They could Lie about their NOMBRE=Name

21. Anonymous - August 14, 2009

    You MUST BE A HOUSTON ELITE CLUB MEMBER,HEY RIDDLE!WHO WROTE THAT?

22. Dexter McCloud - August 14, 2009

    judging from the comments from “Anonymous”, he cares more about this rivalry than Oscar or Bill does…
    I think Ken should enforce a requirement that every blogger leaves his nmae (even if it’s fake). People are a lot more brave when no one knows who they are.
    The idea behind Masters track is COMPETITION. And, some of us (myself included) take it a little more seriously than others. However, to take it seriously does not have to mean you have to try and defame the character of others.
    I know both Bill and Oscar. Whenenver I see either of them get into the blocks, I simply become a fan of track and watch to see who’s going to hit the finish line first.

23. Panama Kid - August 14, 2009

    Hey Dex,I think there is more than one anonymous

24. Bob lida - August 14, 2009

    I want to join the chorus who point out how ridiculous it is to presume that Bill is ducking competition. Anyone hwo has been paying attention whould know he has been dealing with a serious stress frature for over a year. In that time he has continued to compete, when he should probably have been resting. Certainly lack of training may be showing up, but he still competes. And, in my opinion, his close losses have been due to his injury. As far as the Senior Games are concerned, the schedule made it impossible to run quality races in all events. I, for one, pulled out of the 400 becasue of the schedule. I wasn’t ducking anyone, and neither was Bill.

25. Anonymous - August 14, 2009

    I believe you are ranked number 1,WHATS YOUR POINT.When was the last time YOU WERE seriously challenge in a meet/ranking.YOU HURT YOU DON’T RUN,YOU NOT HURT-YOU RUN

26. Anonymous - August 14, 2009

    THERE NOT ALL MY ANONYMOUS.DONT BLAME SCHED. PULL OUT OF THE 4,PULL OUT OF RELAY AND KEEP YOUR BUTT IN HOUSTON IF YOUR HURT

27. Doug Spencer - August 14, 2009

    I Don’t know Oscar, but have seen him run and he is quite good , however, Bill and I are in the same age group just one time every age break , I have run against him and was fortunate (like Ken ) to be able to run with him in the 2001 World’s 4×100, I echo Rick Riddles statement as to Bill’s character. All this is nonesense and I think contary to the “spirit ” of masters track. They are both GREAT athletes and we should not question their motives nor integrity. LET’S LET THIS GO !

28. Weia Reinboud - August 14, 2009

    “And in lane 3 we have an athlete called Anonymous, we do not have any previous results of him, so it will be a mediocre athlete…”

29. Keith Mathis - August 14, 2009

    Is it possible to be lapped in the 100M? Just wondering…because based on my Male 55-59 current 100M ranking I think both Oscar and Bill would lap me..and that is just the way it is.
    Keith Mathis

30. Keith Mathis - August 14, 2009

    Weia,
    We at least know they (the anonymous commentators) are not high jumpers–for we are never anonymous- we challenge the bar with all the world to see–sometimes we make it–sometimes we fail–but what a feeling when we make it!!!

31. Anonymous - August 14, 2009

    Look you up in the rankings and YOU ARE ANONYMOUS-WHATS UP WITH THAT?

32. Anonymous - August 14, 2009

    BUT YOU AND I WOULD RUN BIG FELLA!

33. Keith Mathis - August 14, 2009

    Mr.Anonymous: Name the track and the location for a 1 Meter Lean competition- the trick is to lean very quickly without knocking your beer off the counter. Now as far as the beer to be utilized-
    High Jumpers prefer Coor’s light so as not to carry too much weight over the Bar—Coor’s Light-
    fantastic after a hot August track Meet!!! the rules committee has not yet determined if we will uuse FAT or hand time for the competition.

34. Bubba Sparks - August 14, 2009

    I’m proud to know Bill, the person and the athlete he is. I promise you he’s picking his races based on managing an injury, not opponent. I was injured slightly at Oshkosh and it kept me out of Stanford. Had I taken Bill’s experienced and mature approach, I would have been ready for NSG. I too am trying to regroup for Sydney.
    As a pole vaulter I’ve got no horse in any race. I just know Bill and the guy he is so it bothers me to see that questioned. Bubba

35. Steve Kemp - August 14, 2009

    The REASON that I compete at National and World Championship events in the first place is that I have the chance to compete against the best. Honestly, if I know that I achieved my goal/to my capabilities in an event and didn’t medal, I would be happier than even if I won a medal with a subpar performance.
    Injuries aside, I WANT the best people to show up and test me and to see if my training was enough. Of course, it’s extremely frustrating to compete when we are not at our best, only because it just makes us wonder afterward what we could have done… “what if we had been healthy”. As we all know, injuries at the wrong time just suck.
    What I am trying to say here is that the competition is WHY many of us DO THIS! It’s the outlet that keeps us all striving to be the best we can be. So nobody is ducking anybody.

36. Stefan Waltermann - August 14, 2009

    I asked Ken Stone about some people’s desire and ability to remain anonymous. Ken replied that anonymous contributions sometimes can provide invaluable information that cannot be gained any other way. Ken believes that the self-correcting power of the internet will keep the anonymous ‘contributors’ in check. I asked him to remove offensive or even racist comments, outright bullying and demeaning remarks. Thankfully, Ken removed parts of this strange ‘debate’. By the way, this is a forum for athletes from around the world. If a person from The Netherlands contributes, she cannot be found in the American rankings. Do your research and you will find that Weia Reinbaud is a remarkable woman and she has a right to voice her opinion, ranked or not. She has a name.

37. Kerry Smith - August 14, 2009

    I know Bill, Oscar and Stephen. They are amazing athlete’s. I have raced all of them and have nothing but the greatest respect for their talent’s. All three of them are fierce competitors. I would pay to see the three best M55 sprinters in History go at it. It is a shame that Oscar will not be there. Get well Bill see you in Austalia.

38. mike walker - August 14, 2009

    Since it has become such a big deal to some people, let those who think that Collins is ducking anyone and wants to see him or anyone else run they should be willing to put up the money for their travel expenses.

39. Ken Stone - August 14, 2009

    I have banned the IP address of an anonymous commenter here. This means he can’t post via his home computer.
    He just got too annoying.

40. Ed Italo - August 14, 2009

    Rick,
    I found your comments to be both eloquent and to the point. I was inspired by both Bill and you in our meeting on and off the track at Nationals, no only for your dedication to the sport, but for your sincere generosity.
    Each of us embarks on this second chance journey for personal reasons. We are not professional athletes, paid large salaries to entertain. No man should dance to another’s fiddle. What Bill does, or choses not to do is only important to Bill. In my humble opinion, all else is idle speculation.

41. Rick Riddle - August 14, 2009

    Ed,
    Thank you for the thoughtful words. You have articulated with compactness and clarity, what I labored over, yielding only wordy complication. Well said. You are a gentlemen of tall measure.

42. Roger Pierce - August 14, 2009

    It should also be noted that at the National Senior Games there were no seeding times used. All semi finals and finals places were based on times not place… That made all of us have to extend ourselves in all races in order to ensure placing in the next round. In 55 years of running I have never seen that format used. The second day for the sprints was the most insane schedule for sprinters I have ever encountered.
    This should not happen again.

43. Joe Patridge II - August 14, 2009

    I competed at the National Senior Games and had the opportunity to speak with Bill, Oscar and Charles Allie. They were gracious, friendly and willing to answer questions. Each of these athletes recognized the schedule made it very difficult to compete in the 100, 200 and 400 meters. Charles was able to pull of the triple and compete in the 4 x 100m relay as well. Oscar ran the 100, 200 and 4 x 100m relay. Anyone who attended the meet could see that Bill was not 100%.
    All of these men are an inspiration to me and many other masters athletes. I started running sprints at 49 years of age in part because of these individuals. Let’s recognize the accomplishments of these great athletes and appreciate what they have done to advance our sport. For many of us World’s and National’s are not an option. I’m glad that Charles, Bill and Oscar chose to compete at the Senior Games. Thanks gentlemen!

44. David E. Ortman (M56) Seattle, WA - August 14, 2009

    O.K., its time to name National Senior Games names. According to the NSG website, the two Track and Field “co-chairs” were Rick Milam and Joy Upshaw Margerum
    http://www.2009seniorgames.org/sports-track-field
    But where was Ms. Margerum during the insane scheduling of the National Senior Games track meet? That is unclear. But what is clear is that during most of the National Senior Games Ms. Margerum was in Finland at the WMA meet and not in Palo Alto keeping an eye on the National Senior Games. No one questions Ms. Margerum’s knowledge of track and field. But if you are named as NSG co-chair, then don’t let the NSG turn into a fiasco.

45. Weia Reinboud - August 15, 2009

    In the main open class championships it is only injuries that prevent someone to show up, but for us it is injuries, time/opportunity, meet schedules, money and even ecology. It is always a surprise who will show up and who not, and so the competition is never what it could have been. A pity, but understandable.
    I did not go to Lahti for reasons of money — and also very important: the father of my friend is so old we did not like to go on holiday to Finland. The field in javelin throw of my age group, W55, was the best possible, I would have loved to be beaten by those three excellent throwers! On the other hand the field in the high jump was an example of not showing up of the better jumpers. The best jumper in our age group is a French former olympian who never does meets outside Paris… A friend of mine from the Netherlands had no opportunity this time but would have won easily. For me the same.
    But so it is. I do not see a solution. Blaming all wo not show up isn’t he solution, that’s sure.

46. peter taylor - August 16, 2009

    Thanks, Ken, for giving us the info on the M55 sprints at Palo Alto (Sr Games). I hope that no one missed the big point of all this, the take-home message as I think they call it (at least for me).
    The Sr Games had 44 men who ran in the M55 dash preliminaries. Although I have frequently heard (and I am sure there are many instances where this is true) that the Sr Games can’t match the masters when it comes to quality of competition, I could not help but notice that an astonishing 41 of the 44 men ran 14.41 seconds or faster (I was looking for 14.44 or better in my analysis).
    I established 14.44 as a cutoff for good sprinting because the world mark for M55 is 11.44 (by none other than Bill Collins) — in other words, I was looking for people who could run within 3 seconds of the world record.
    Now, how did we do at Oshkosh? At Oshkosh there were no preliminaries in the M55 100, and the final had only 7 competitors. If you look at USATF.org you will see only 6, but Oscar Peyton was also there.
    I went through the list of all 44 competitors at the Sr Games twice and saw only 12 I had announced in the past. I went through a third time and found a 13th (just a possibility). My conclusion: Masters T&F, as I have argued before, is missing a huge number of quality athletes — in this case 29 of them. What to do about that is something I will leave to those in charge.

47. Steve Kemp - August 16, 2009

    Maybe a survey could be done with the Palo Alto competitors vs. the Oshkosh competitors and ask each group why they chose to compete in the venue that they chose. Was it location? Did they think they had a better chance to medal? Maybe they didn’t realize that only 7 people would make it to the starting line at the U.S. National Championships vs. 44 at the Senior Games. At least everybody in Oshkosh could say they made the finals!
    It is surprising to me, though that so many more people would pick the Senior Games instead of the “real” National Championships. Anybody here want to comment on why you went to Palo Alto instead of Oshkosh?

48. Michael Daniels - August 16, 2009

    My experience with the Senior meets vs USATF is the organization. The USATF meets I go to are always on top of things and I always feel confortable about taking a long or short drive to get there. Plus they are consistant in order of events etc. As for the Senior meets, I have gone to, they have a plan. Sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn’t. To me they are more of a grass-roots of masters track. They get many first timers.
    Also Senior meets are not just track and field they have other sport events attacked to them. So their eye’s are not just on us track fokes.
    I am glad to be able to go to any of them. I have two meets left this year both are in Kentucky. Bearea, KY a first time Senior multiple games event September 12. Then the Kentucky State USATF masters meet in October. I’m from OHIO and in Kentucky it doesn’t matter which organization has the meet, they usually have FAT timing and qualified officals. I have been off for about a month because of injuries and hope to make both.
    Too answer your question I would have gone to the USATF Nationals based on potentional harder competition and confidence in how the meet would be run.
    Michael Daniels m60

49. Michael Daniels - August 16, 2009

    Spell check on Berea. Not Bearea. http://www.berea.edu for track meet information

50. David E. Ortman (M56) Seattle, WA - August 16, 2009

    NSG vs. USATF National Championships
    1. For most of the country, there is far more exposure to “senior games” than masters USATF.
    Every state seems to have a State Senior Games and often local area senior games. In contrast, there are large sections of the country without any sanctioned USATF masters meet. For example, South Dakota has local area senior games and a State Senior Games, but zero USATF masters meets. As a result, far more athletes over 50 participate in the Senior Games track program (even though the results are often suspect because I’ve seen Senior Games use high schoolers and volunteers as officials, report hand times as hundredths, refuse to measure the high jump bar when raising heights, don’t know the proper steps for the triple jump, etc).
    The few USATF Masters Regional Meets each year simply cover too much territory. For example, the chances of lots of Wyoming athletes showing up in Seattle for a NW Masters Regional Meet are slim to none, even though they are in the NW region.
    2. USATF does not promote masters T&F. Instead of seeing masters USATF as an extension of lifetime fitness, USATF is all about bean counting US medal totals at the Olympics and World Championships. The Penn Relays represent the worst of this trend. Rather than celebrating masters races, USATF promotes TV coverage by bringing in elite/open runners and setting up phony US vs. the “World” relay races.
    3. Put one and two together and you get blank stares from friends and family who don’t see USATF national meets as a masters equivalent to the Open USATF National Championships. Rather they want to know how you’ve done in the biennial (every two year) National Senior Games (even though the NSG has some really stupid rules such as making you qualify a whole year in advance. And if you are are 54, you must qualify in the 50-54 age group, even though you can run in the 55-59 age group the following year. And they refuse to include hurdle events!).
    Previous attempts to integrate/coordinate USATF and the National Senior Games alas went into the ditch.
    As a result, the only real measure of who is on top of masters/seniors track and field at the end of the year is the excellent masters Ranking list.

51. Steve Kemp - August 16, 2009

    Hi Dave,
    So it appears that since USATF Masters Nationals has the same events, with modifications for hurdles and implements as the Olympic Games, for example, and likely the best officiating and is an extension of the USATF organization which runs our elite program, that it would be the preferable meet to attend and not the Senior Games…if one were choosing one over the other.
    That’s what it sounds like. I still don’t understand the huge difference in turnout with Senior Games.

52. Ocean - August 16, 2009

    Bill Collins has my upmost respect. He and anyone else has the right to make a personal decision what race one would like to run in or not on any given day.
    My only comments are to those who would verbally attack a fellow competitor. Where are your sportsmanship behaviors? Why do you feel you have to judge someone? I wonder? Clean up your closets before you point fingers.

53. enrico - August 16, 2009

    a big regard to all the friends of masterstrack

54. Michael Daniels - August 17, 2009

    Hello Steve
    It could be by fact, many of the senior meets are connected to other events making it a total olympic type experience for those who do more than one sport and a large participation pull.
    USATF is track only. So your total network of recruiting participants is smaller.
    One thing I have found this summer is more track meet organizers are combining masters events into their youth track meets.
    Michael Daniels

55. peter taylor - August 17, 2009

    And since Ocean E. added a comment about Bill Collins, I will add one myself. The man is a hoss. What I have seen him do when he should not have even been running has just been amazing.
    Bill and I go back a long way, and he’s one of my favorite competitors. I also like Oscar Peyton, Charles Allie, Steve Robbins, Roger Pierce, Bobby Whilden, Renee “The Jet” Henderson, Jai Black, Liz Palmer, and about 550 other masters sprinters. In fact, among masters who run the short distances I would say I have about 560 favorites (this responds to an earlier discussion).
    PLT

56. panama kid - August 18, 2009

    I want some of “that”But give some DARK PANAMANIAN BEER- Gratis of course

57. Mark Hastings - August 18, 2009

    I am also a friend of Bill Collins and attended both OshKosh and Palo Alto. Bill is the only person I know in my 5 short years of Masters Track that does not have an ego, including myself.I have never seen him dodge a race because of who was entered. What is interesting about all of this debate is that Bill and Oscar seemed to have become pretty good friends over the past couple of years. Since Bill won’t say an unkind word about anyone I can’t be sure how he felt about Oscar 5 years ago but they seem to get along well at meets. I saw Oscar buy Bill’s new book at OshKosh. Bill and Oscar are probably getting a good chuckle out of everyone’s remarks here. I traveled with Bill and Stephanie to Palo Alto and back and we couldn’t say anything funny without Bill hacking and coughing while he laughed so he was not over the flu quite yet. I admire both guys as they are truly world class sprinters. I can’t imagine a meet without the competition they bring to races.

58. Kenneth - August 18, 2009

    Regarding the Senior Games: the NSGA does a much better job of marketing their events at the grass roots level. They market through allied organizations (Senior Council on Aging,etc), to get 50+ adults more active. The multi sport approach is part of the draw, but from what I’ve seen, most of the T&F participants, are at the event for track only.
    Where I live there is 1 USATF masters only event each year, but there are several NSGA state games within a 2-3 hour drive (MA, NH, ME, RI, CT). Each of the NSGA events is held on a different weekend, so you could compete in all of them if you wanted to.
    From my experience, the NSGA events are often poorly officiated. The emphasis is on having fun by competing. At one meet I attended, the official (who was a MA HS state certified official) actually subtracted inches from a foul throw, because the thrower didn’t mean to foul. He figured the thrower went 5 inches beyond the toe board, so he subtracted 5 inches off of the throw.
    At the same time about 50% of the participants at NSGA meets, do not attend USATF meets. Why-most because they know nothing of the USATF, but those that do, are lower level performers that do not want the “pressure” of the USATF meet.
    When the USATF national meet was scheduled for Florida this year, I decided to give the NSGA national meet a try. When the decision was made to move the meet to WI, I changed my mind and went to the USATF meet instead. Why-because I felt I’d be able to experience a first class meet (which it was). Based on the experiences at the NSGA meet that I’ve seen posted above, I feel I made the right choice.
    Still the NSGA meet seems to draw equal caliber competition, but with much deeper entries. As Dave pointed out, much of that fault lies with the USATF, and the lack of opportunities afforded to masters athletes in much of the country. I’m lucky enough to reside in an association where we have a masters championship meet each year, and I could also drive to 3-4 other association meets if I wanted to. Still, the opportunity to compete locally, at masters only meets is limited. The NSGA state games allow me 2-3 closer meets to compete in.
    In my area, the local youth club opened up their all comers meets to masters athletes as well. I showed up one night to test myself at 100m, but found out I was the only masters runner to show up, and would run with a bunch of 10-12 year olds. I felt so out of place, I went home instead.

59. Michael Daniels - August 18, 2009

    Ken you may have been the only masters at the meet but you have showed them the interest is there.
    Many of the all comers meets and youth meets in Ohio and Kentucky where I mostly run are including masters. It might be the new trend to spark interest and increase total interest in our sport at all age levels. Plus a greater chance of better meet management since forces are combined during the same weekend.
    Many times I ran by myself at those meets just for a time trial in the hurdles or something.

60. Marion Berg - August 18, 2009

    I just read these comments regarding NSGA and USATF Masters meets and would like point out that I am from South Dakota and we don’t have any USATF meets for seniors only. I do happen to live close to Colorado and have a 4 hour drive to reach their USATF MEETS.
    I attend NSGA meets because there are 3 within a one hour drive and several others 3 hours away. I did not even know about USATF until I had been competing for 5 years. Perhaps USATF should attend some of these state meets and spread the word of additional opportunities for masters competition at the national level.

61. Bradley Gardner - August 18, 2009

    Look up “Class” in the dictionary, and what do you see? Pictures of Rick Riddle, Bill Collins, Oscar Peyton, Mark Hastings, and others – all who so eloquently understand the true meaning of this great and unique sport.
    We who care passionately about Masters Track and Field know who and what matters.
    “Judge the tree by the fruit that it bears”.

62. David Janson - August 28, 2009

    The schedule was a travesty. The organizers should be ashamed to have any athlete, much less seniors, running three 400 meter races in two days. There was no reason for it. You should have run one qualifying round and taken the best 9 times (there were nine lanes). Then, come back with the finals of the 400 meters on Tuesday (one day of rest). This allows the athletes who are also running in the 200 meters to concentrate on this event on the off days. Louisville used this kind of schedule. In fact, they used the same process for both sprints (200 and 400 meters) — one prelim, take the best nine times to the finals and give eight awards on the podium. If the same schedule that was developed for Stanford is used for Houston, I will not be participating. Several other competitiors told me they also will not return to these games — opting instead to attend the National Masters meets. I spoke with the Stanford trainers and the doctors at the Stanford Emergency Room about the schedule. They all agreed that the schedule was dangerous and poorly conceived. I attended against my orthopedic surgeon’s advice and truly regretted it. I ended up in the Stanford Hospital ER. If this schedule was used in Berlin or China for the Olympics and the World Games, the athletes would have revolted.
    The saddest part is that my doctor and I tried to warn them last March with a letter outlining our fears when they first hinted at such a schedule. There response was that they knew what they were doing. How arrogant!

63. Steven Snow - September 1, 2009

    The National Senior Games in Palo Alto were less expensive for me to attend than the Oshkosh event, since I was able to stay with my youngest brother and not pay for a hotel. I could not afford to attend both. I enjoyed the NSG in Palo Alto, although I agree that the schedule was demanding. I decided to forego the 400m to enhance my chances in the 100 and 200.
    As far as the competitors go, I found none there expressing attitudes like those of some of the anonymous posters here, thankfully. My teammates from Mass Velocity were uniformly supportive, as were many others, including Neil Steinberg, Greg Pizza, and Oscar Peyton, to name just a few.
    The state Senior Games in my area (New England) tend to be well run; many of the officials wear USATF shirts. That certainly is true of the Granite State Senior Games and also, I believe, of the Maine Senior Games. The level of competition at those events is also quite good, whereas in 2008 at the USATF Maine Masters Championships I was the only competitor in my age group in the sprints. That takes a lot of the fun out of it.

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