Masters maestro playing host to W30 rehabber Marion Jones
Marion Jones
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Seth Brower, brother of world-class M50 hurdler Jeff Brower, is a meet organizer in South Texas of some repute. He’s a great friend of masters athletes and youth as well. And everyone knows how forgiving masters are. We all have “issues.” Now one of the top “issue” people of all time is coming to one of his youth meets in November. Here’s how Seth shared the news in email: “I’m sure you all know the name Marion Jones. Marion of course got caught up in the illegal substance thing and paid the price. Well, she is on a path to do what she can to make sure kids don’t make the same mistake. Marion will be doing some kind of youth talk and a clinic prior to the meet on Nov. 14.”
Seth continues:
Don’t have all the specifics, but please use this opportunity to get the word out to your youth athletes and have them attend. The tentative plan is for her talk and clinic to take place in the morning, followed by the meet itself. I will keep you posted on the details as I get them.
This is interesting — Marion taking her Mea Culpa Tour to Texas! The Nov. 14 meet apparently is the Lions Club Relays in Austin, Texas.
Well, I realize the wider track and field community may ream her big time. But I want Marion to know she’ll have a more accepting audience among masters tracksters. Your reputation needs major rehab. But not a bad idea to start with kids and geezers. As if we’ve never done anything in our lives to be ashamed of!
And Marion is only a year away from turning 35! That happens after Sacramento masters nationals in 2010 but well before Sacramento worlds in 2011.
And since she’s a California girl, why not make WMA worlds your comeback meet? (And haul Stacy Dragila out of retirement while you’re at it; Stacy would be returning to the site of one of her vault world records.)
In any case, Seth Brower also had some other news in his email:
Hello, everyone: Have several updates so please bear with me.
1) Results from the USATF Open Championships on Aug 23 are ready at:Â http:usatfsouthtexas.org/results/20090823results.htm For those that attended, please look them over and let me know if any questions before I send off to National Masters News and USATF.
2) My relationship with North Austin Lions Club is ending after many years of putting on meets. This is primarily due to the club not being able to support me with volunteers and meet management.
The status of the Lions fields and the throwing meets is still up in the air. I’ll keep the throwing community updated on that. So what does this mean for future meets? Not much really. I will still be putting them on, it just won’t be that particular Lions club which receives the proceeds. May be other Lions clubs, Boy/Girl Scouts, American Cancer Society, who knows.
The main thing I will need is a group that can supply me with at least 40 volunteers. I can get the officials, just need the other folks. I will put these meets on anywhere. Doesn’t even have to be the Austin area. So if you have an organization you can hook me up with to bring a meet to your area, please contact me so I can get the 2010 calendar set. Know that I don’t have facility arrangments outside of Austin.
So, a key element would be the local folks using their contacts and get a good deal on the facility rental.
3) We now have access to the Finish Lynx Timing System. Yeah! Have not bought our own yet, but have a person who is letting us borrow the one he has. So, please know that for most meets now, we will have that system in place.
4) Nov 14. I still want to have one more full meet this fall. I need a facility in the Austin area. The ones I normally could use are not available due to other committments or are on hold in case certain football teams make the playoffs and need the field. So, if any of you have a contact in the Austin or surrounding area, let me know. . . .
 6) Nov. 7 is our Associations Junior Olympic Cross Country meet in Marble Falls, Tx. All forms and info are at: http://usatfsouthtexas.org/youth.htm We realize many school meets are that weekend. We can waive students that are running in their school meets. They just need to fill out the form and let me know.
7) Also Nov. 7, before the JO meet, we are having an Open and Masters XC Championship run. It will be at the same location, Camp Champions, in Marble Falls We’ll have the entry form on the usatfsouthtexas.org website soon. It’s a 5k course.
8) Finally, some folks have asked me about a fall track program. I am looking into putting on about 4-6 mini-meets this fall, probably starting sometime mid-October and going through November, or even early December. Before I do a lot of work on this, I would like to know the level of interest.
So, if you would compete in these meets, every two weeks on either a Saturday or Sunday afternoon, let me know. Here are the probable events: Races: 50, 100, 200, 400, 800, 1500, 3000, 5000, 4Ă—1 relay, 4Ă—4 relay, 100/110 hurdles, 300/400 hurdles. Field events: long jump, triple jump, shot, discus. Entry fees would be low, something like $15 unlimited events which will be reduced to $5 unlimited events if a member of USATF.
By the way, if you join USATF after Nov 1 your membership is good for the rest of 2009 and all of 2010. Here’s the link: https://www.usatf.org/membership/application/ Again, this will be in the Austin area, every two weeks. So give me a heads up if at all interested Thanks to all and see you on the track and in the field!
And Marion — stay focused on the positive and remember the good times. Like when you pleased your fans at the Mt. SAC Relays in April 2004:
33 Responses
I’m sorry to hear that Seth is ending his relationship with the N Austin Lions. We had some good times at that facility, and Seth’s meets have been the backbone of the masters track and field scene in Central Texas for years.
I hope this change only represents the beginning of a new and better “chapter” for masters meets in the Austin area…
I took my son Sean to that 2004 Mt. SAC meet. And I took him for one reason: to see the great Marion Jones run. Turned out she was a cheater. And not just a little ol’ halfway cheater, but as big a cheater and liar as our sport has seen. She only confessed her cheating as part of a plea deal related to her simultaneous conviction as part of a check fraud scheme.
Throughout her career, Marion chose to associate and form close personal and coaching relationships with some of the biggest PED cheaters in our sport. No one forced her to do this. She made the decision – not once, but over and over and over.
So what lesson did she learn from her ordeal? What awakening of conscience and ethics was born from her time in prison? … Well, this is what she told Oprah after being released: “I thought I was taking a supplement … Never knowingly did I take performance enhancing drugs.”
It was all her coach’s fault.
So no, Ken, I’m not part of the forgiving masters crowd that wants to see Marion back in our sport – not talking to kids in the sport and not competing in our masters meets. She forfeited that right, as far as I’m concerned, when by her actions and her continued denials she contributed to the destruction of our sport.
Of course she deserves a second chance in life. And of course I wish her only the best in that second chance. But as far as track goes, our sport doesn’t need anymore of Marion.
Very few of us can place ourselves at the station of life where Ms. Jones finds herself today. How it feels to serve time in prison, whether you are Marion Jones or Michael Vick, is a feeling reserved for those that know the experience as a personal reality.
I have never been in prison. However, I have designed prisons. No amount of architectural creativity, or social engineering, can ease the stark reality that a prison is an abysmal environment. I have toured them throughout the U.S. and I have seen the inner workings in an intimate manner. I will make no social or cultural judgment about prisons in this comment, but I tell you from experience and knowledge certain; there is a soul crushing environment that exists therein.
Marion is one of many that have crossed the line with performance enhancing drugs. She was caught. Many have not been caught. Is she less effective to speak with kids about track and field and drug use than the athlete that does so with a stained, yet undiscovered past?
The celerity with which our judgment arrives in these cases, is testament to our own delectation with the pain of our fellow athletes that have been captured by drug testing. I know from personal discussion with friends who are professional track athletes and with friends who are major league baseball players, that the question of using performance enhancing drugs exceeds the simplicity of weighing health and honor against an empty white sheet. The equipoise required for the professional athlete may not be intelligible to the amateur masters athlete.
First read may cause you to believe I accept cheating in the sport. I do not. But, it is also worth pointing out that I have no rational incentive to cheat, apart from becoming faster, which for all us sprinters owns substantial glitter of its own, does it not?
Should we tell Mr. Brower he can’t decide that Ms. Jones owns an important message for youth? Just as importantly, should we judge Ms. Jone’s life with our distant vision and judge her unworthy of owning a redemptive capacity? Can we judge, without a farrago of reasonable questions, that another athlete will fail to benefit from her message?
It is my opinion that responsibility for deciding if Ms. Jones has a worthy message lies with the parents of the child invited to listen. If Ms. Jones applies her message in a positive and assiduous manner, her redemption can become her reality, particularly in the sport of track and field.
Kick her to the bottom of the well? I suspect she has been there already, while many of the mutually guilty looked down on her without confession.
Wow…
To Pete, I can only say that I hope you’ve never gone down the wrong path and struggled to find your way back. Your attitude leaves no room for forgiveness. I’d hate for you or anyone else to experience what you are dishing out. To Rick, I agree with you. Obviously, I can’t condone the use of performance enhancing drugs, and steriods. The rampant use of these things by athletes who are role models compounds the problem immeasurably. And, because we never hear much about the sometimes terrible cost in side effects associated, it makes it seem, to a kid, to be harmless. It’s a huge problem, but why can’t we remember that in the end we are all just people, and therefore inherently flawed? I’ve done some pretty dumb things and I’ll bet Pete has, too.
A healthy perspective is one thing that allows masters track and field athletes to continue onward with a positive attitude and enjoy their sport. An unhealthy perspective will rob one of enjoying life. We have an opportunity to support another human being. Sure we should make it tough for her, so she truly appreciates earning our trust. Make it tough. A little love. But be ready to open the door. She is giving us all an opportunity to grow. Compassion does that. It helps us grow. I choose compassion.
I’ve since learned that Marion and husband Obadele Thompson now live in Austin. So that explains why she’s appearing at a youth meet there.
Also, according to a track journalist I spoke to, this represents her first “toe in the water” of T&F since being released from prison a year ago.
An article reported:
Sprinter Marion Jones was released from a federal detention facility Friday after completing a six-month sentence for lying to federal agents investigating the BALCO doping conspiracy.
Jones was released at 8 a.m., according to LaTanya Robinson, an officer at the San Antonio community corrections office, which oversees halfway houses such as the one Jones was in.
Jones, 32, must now complete 800 hours of community service and will be on probation for two years.
Read more:
http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/more_sports/2008/09/05/2008-09-05_marion_jones_released_from_prison.html
This brings us back to the question of using performance enhancing drugs as a masters athlete. Despite the fact that we hope everyone competing side by side with us are on the up and up, there are very high odds that a few, just a few do use HgH and anabolics. High school, college, open and elite athletes all to a certain extent take them. We cannot put our heads in the sand and think that certain masters athletes who suddenly pop up out of nowhere and win world championships, beating established champions in the process or keep getting better with age (Like Barry Bonds did) after age 40 are ALL 100% clean.
I have nothing against those proponents of HgH like Sylvester Stallone, who in his last movie at age 62 looked better than he did at 32 because it’s his body that he is experimenting with. But if you take something like that and then realize you can turn yourself in a matter of months into a potential World Champion in the masters, we have to draw the line firmly against it or else what’s the point of those of us not cheating at all trying to compete against those who are?
I would vote for a permanent lifetime ban for the first offense. I have been a masters athlete long enough to overhear mutterings of certain people who are “on” or “off” various substances and I don’t believe that it’s all sour grapes. With certain supplements, there are obvious physical transformations that take place which were never there before….especially if that person is over 50. Certain types of muscularatures are common for those taking illegal supplements. I know for a fact that no matter how hard or long I train in the gym, it is just NOT physically possible for me to look like I did when I was 30 anymore….unless I were to cheat. And you would have to shoot me first before I would ever discredit myself or my sport to do that.
I believe that almost all masters athletes never give any thought that some people may cheat…because it’s not a high number so they may poo-poo the odds that it ever happens. My only point here is that there is no place for it in our meets, even those that take illegals to speed recovery.
Here is my suggestion: Do a random blood test on maybe ten medalists each Nationals and Worlds. Cost-wise, if we each contributed a dollar or so extra in our meet entry fees, it would cover a $200 test. I don’t know if this is enough, but it’s a starting point. Nobody who is clean should have any problem with this. I certainly don’t. New technology for testing for HgH is being tested and since most HgH users shoot synthetic HgH, there are markers that will indicate that and can be tested for.
I wish there was an easier way like all of us signing an affidavit that we don’t cheat. In a perfect world, that’s all we would have to do.
No need to sign an affidavit.
Just look at the back of your USATF card.
It’s called the Membership Pledge.
Give her a break. The public humiliation she (and her family) has experienced will never be erased. She already knows that by reintroducing herself to the T&F community she will be under intense scrutiny if she decides to participate in any future events, even as a masters athlete. There are people who will scorn her forever, perhaps thinking–rightfully so–that she’s taken something from them personally. It’s helpful to remember that old saying: “Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me.” Leave the door open for trust. If she blows it again, slam it shut. But I have a feeling that she won’t disappoint this time around.
Track & Field News message board lively, too:
http://www.trackandfieldnews.com/discussion/viewtopic.php?t=37648
Cheating can be forgiven…
Lying while cheating, perhaps, could be forgiven..
But lying, after the fact, even now !
Strike 3 !
She has never come clean on this. Her credibility is shot to hell and that was her choice. She deserves nothing !
Her only shot at redemption in T&F is to admit she knew what was going on the whole time !
Either one chooses to forgive or not to forgive, a personal choice. Finding the correct rehab for the crime committed has always been a challenge for our court system, thus we have a higher number of repeat offenders and an increased expansion of our prisons being designed and built. Maybe Marion is doing this because she has to meet her community service hour requirement. If she is doing it because it is something she wants to do; the gesture is good and the sincerity of her actions will surely be judged over time. She has to start somewhere in making amends and asking for true forgiveness. Good for you Mr. Brower in taking a chance with her!
Redemption is free as salvation, she only answerable to the Lord Jesus Christ, and not man.She does’t owe no one anything, because Jesus aready forgive her and not man. She should go on with her life in Jesus’s name. And, allow the ungorgiving and unbelief spirited individuals to go to their collective hell. So, stay strong and believe that out of your many, so call friends, God will pick the right ones for you, in Jesus name. Amen and Amen.
Some of the worst mistakes, are the ones we are caugth in . Marion has paid her price to society. The one who hate the most are ones who will never be in her lime light. Be it good are bad. If she is to contribute to T&F once again it could be her great attribute, to want to come after the humiliation and embarrassment shows true love for the sport. If anyone is able to says he has not committed a sin he’s a liar, some get caught, but we all live with the truth within ourself, we know we should have. Give her a second chance. I feel the best in her is yet to come.
Rick:
I am still confused about the best place to find “farrago”, but hope to have a balance in finding “equipoise.”
I speedily found “celerity,” and was persistent enough to have found “assiduous”, and was very happy to find “delectation.”
Marion Jones is not just a cheat but a repetitive liar who for years caught many supportive people in her web, and throughout her years of lying rationalized and allowed others to back her up when she knew she was lying—and only under pressure of prosecutions did she come clean.
Why on earth would we want that as a speaking model to kids?
I even did opeds on her behalf while it turned out later she was lying, with my making the case that only evidence should convict someone. Many believed her BS. With the evidence finally trapping her involuntarily, why should we now give her any benefit of any doubt? There is no doubt. She was a horrible role model and remains so.
Regards,
Bob Weiner, former spokesman, White House Office of National Drug Control Policy
Professor Gray,
My hurdling friend of unmatched ability;
farrago = a medley, mixture or hodegpodge of items.
That’s from the top of my balding head, Webster may be more articulate in description.
Translation; Can we judge, without a MEDLEY of reasonable questions, that another athlete will fail to benefit from her message?
Sorry for the transfusion of obscure words. It’s because I have grown weary of phrasing such as “Oh WOW, you rock dude” and similar insipid commentary that passes for literacy.
I don’t argue the point that Ms. Jones is a liar, cheat, etc. Life is filled with them. I argue that her capacity for redemption as the years pass, is known only to her, and not to me. Any parent can judge if their child should receive her message. My children are grown and I’m retired from those decisions.
It’s not about lying, it’s about continuing to lie. If you’ve ever read Pete’s blog (and if ya haven’t ya probably should) you’d know he’s upfront, willingly admits his mistakes and shares his embarrassing past. Generous and forgiving. Usually. Yet he’s also passionate about, and protective of, the sport he loves. It’s frustrating that any new record immediately is suspicious. That’s not fair to the Usain Bolts or any age group record holder. (Now, even a bizarre Anon thinks Pete should take a drug test. Some might think Anon should go back on his Meds but that’s another drug test)
Pete, Bob W. and Chuckxc are upset at Marion for what she did and then continues to do. (Remember she sued the state of California, with the help of Jonnie Cochran, when she missed a drug test back in high school.) Okay, now she served her time, lost her medals, why not come clean and start over fresh? Take responsibility and be a great role model. Nope, on Oprah she had the chance but didn’t.
She went to jail because she twice lied. Before sentencing she wrote that her lawyers had advised her to answer the questions honesly. Yet on Oprah now she says she wished she’d asked a lawyer about lying. Huh? And that she didn’t knowingly take steroids and just thought they were supplements even though Victor Conte, head of Balco, said he helped her with the injections. And her ex-husband, drug cheat, CJ Hunter said he saw her inject herself. She’s been married to, or involved with, (Tim Montgomery) a few other drug cheats as coaches (Trevor Graham) yet still claims it’s not her fault.
Yes, we’re all human and most of us want to give someone another chance. Just like we’d like to be given. But it’s hard to forgive someone who doesn’t think they need to be forgiven. It’s hard to forgive a convicted lier who continues to lie with conviction.
It’s not about lying, it’s about continuing to lie. If you’ve ever read Pete’s blog (and if ya haven’t ya probably should) you’d know he’s upfront, willingly admits his mistakes and shares his embarrassing past. Generous and forgiving. Usually. Yet he’s also passionate about, and protective of, the sport he loves. It’s frustrating that any new record immediately is suspicious. That’s not fair to the Usain Bolts or any age group record holder. (Now, even a bizarre Anon thinks Pete should take a drug test. Some might think Anon should go back on his Meds but that’s another drug test)
Pete, Bob W. and Chuckxc are upset at Marion for what she did and then continues to do. (Remember she sued the state of California, with the help of Jonnie Cochran, when she missed a drug test back in high school.) Okay, now she served her time, lost her medals, why not come clean and start over fresh? Take responsibility and be a great role model. Nope, on Oprah she had the chance but didn’t.
She went to jail because she twice lied. Before sentencing she wrote that her lawyers had advised her to answer the questions honesly. Yet on Oprah now she says she wished she’d asked a lawyer about lying. Huh? And that she didn’t knowingly take steroids and just thought they were supplements even though Victor Conte, head of Balco, said he helped her with the injections. And her ex-husband, drug cheat, CJ Hunter said he saw her inject herself. She’s been married to, or involved with, (Tim Montgomery) a few other drug cheats as coaches (Trevor Graham) yet still claims it’s not her fault.
Yes, we’re all human and most of us want to give someone another chance. Just like we’d like to be given. But it’s hard to forgive someone who doesn’t think they need to be forgiven. It’s hard to forgive a convicted lier who continues to lie with conviction.
Boy, did this thread take a turn. I think it may be time to rethink the anonymous post option. If you have something intelligent to add to a thread, put you name to it!
This thread has had some of the strangest comments I’ve ever read. I would love to see Marion have a second chance because I believe in redemption. We all deserve a shot at it. However in order to be redeemed you have to fully admit fault. Marion hasn’t done that. So as much as I want to root for her to pull herself up from the lowest point of her life by being an example of how to turn it around and do the right thing, I can’t quite do it. I’d love to, but I can’t because she hasn’t fulfilled her part of the deal. She hasn’t taken full responsibility for her actions. Maybe children would be OK with hearing her message without having the backing of her conscience behind it. Sadly, I wouldn’t be.
What Marion wants to do just isn’t quite good enough.
Please Marion, come clean…FULLY clean. I’d be one of your biggest supporters and fans if you did.
a dear friend of mine once said ” let he who is without sin cast the first stone ”
This is going to start getting REAL intersting
I think I saw “anonymous” at one of those health care Town Hall meetings…..
I’ve started reading this Blog more for the comments than the news! Anyway, eventually it will return to the “sport” instead of the “circus.”
I would not take my grandchild to hear her speak about anything.
This is one of those occasions where one might hope that she shows up to speak and no one turns up to listen.
reminds me of the childhood rhyme – “liar, liar pants on fire”. But OTOH – it might be fun to watch her nose grow longer and longer.
Oh, the irony, the word equipose (a steriod) is used in a discussion about PED’s. LOL!
But seriously folks, not only do we need random testing of national & world meet medalists, we also need SPECIFICALLY TARGETED testing of masters athletes that clearly exhibit symptoms of steriod & HGH use. For those of you who may ask what are those symptoms, please see the list below.
1. Steroids – Abnormal muscluar & vascular development…if it looks freakish & unnatural, then it usually is.
2. Steroids – Skin that exhibits a reddish or purplish tint…you have to love it when you see this at indoor meets in the winter.
3. Steroids – Nasty looking acne on the backs, arms, and shoulders of masters atletets is not normal.
4. HGH = Bloated, but muscular abdominal wall…by nature lean & muscular means slim, not 6-pack cannonball.
Now, if you would like to see an example of an athlete that exhibits these symptoms then just watch the next Colorado Rockies game to see if you can spot Jason Giambi. Mr. Giambi is an admitted PED user that apologized publcly for “all of that stuff.” He also has nasty acne on his right bicep that he covers up with a flimsy light blue pad that he takes off in the dugout and on the field. His skin exhibits a reddish/purpelish tint and he has a very thick neck and a ridiculous looking vein in his bulging left bicep.
If you would like to see an example of masters track athlete that exhibits symptoms of PED use, then take a look at the female sprinter that competes in the 65 – 69 age group. This woman has previously been suspended for PED use, but she still has reddish/purpleish skin, over-developed deltoids & arms (w-veins), and a muscular cannon ball stomach.
Your observations make sense. Don’t know the specific athlete you speak of but I have a list of three or four others who compete in masters meets that I am pretty certain of. If you have been around weight rooms or at an elite level of sports long enough, you can go into any gym in the United States and pick out those who are juicing with steroids or HgH if you know what to look for. Once you see the physical characteristics appear on somebody and they can recover in no time from incredible workouts or in several events at meets, PR several days in a row in big meets, and physically just “look different” than what you see in 99% of other athletes their age, you can figure it out.
Another known side effect of HgH is unexplained fluid retention in weird places. Packs of fluid under the skin like under your elbow or something…as well as head and hand bone growth. Sometimes those don’t show up until extended use.
In any case, like you say, let’s test and get the cheaters out of our sport!
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/columnists/owen_slot/article6853699.ece
Hey, look….we’re ALL going to do the test. Enough said. Let’s be serious about this subject, if possible. If there is something you disagree with about our discussion, just be specific about your point and it will be well taken.
Well, they have drug testing at the World & European Championships. And at many National Championships as well, at least in Europe. In the US, it is too expensive, of course. Adding a few dollars to the entry fee and becoming credible in the eyes of the rest of the world would be money well spent. I would also support a policy of out of competition testing. Hell, I would generously donate to a drug testing fund as long as USATF would promise to use my money as intended and not to hold a functionary-only conference on relay teams in Rio. And that’s a promise. By the way, the Europeans select athletes for drug testing who show signs of drug use. Good idea.
That’s the best idea yet! It’s just empirical evidence….someone who comes out of nowhere with no previous masters titles, wins world championships, does like 10 or 15 events in five days with little or no evidence that they need recovery…exaggerated muscular development for their age…if it walks like a duck and talks like a duck, it’s a duck, right?
SANYA REED, CORAL SPRINGS, FL (10 YEAR OLD SPRINTER. I think Marion should be allowed to be involved in T&F. She can be a VALUABLE TOOL because she had EXPERIENCE both world. Every ine makes MISTAKES, no one is PERFECT. More POWER to you Marion, GOOD LUCK and GOD BLESS.
Seth Brower writes today:
1)Nov 15. USATF/Lions 20th Relays is confirmed for St Michaels Academy here in Austin(where we were on Aug 23). I know it’s a Sunday, but other facilities would not committ because of possible football playoff scenarios where stadiums might be needed. Online entry information will be available at: http://usatfsouthtexas.org/schedule.htm Just scroll down to Nov 15 and click. We will be using FINISH LYNX timing system at this meet.
Special notes for this meet. Marion Jones is confirmed and will give her “Take a Break” message which is designed to help kids, coaches, parents, make the right choices by just stepping back and “taking a break” when faced with a bad choice. She will speak from 9AM-9:45AM. There is no cost for this so please get the word out to as many kids/parents as you can. More info will be on the website above. Also(and I don’t have the names yet), there will be two Olympians conducting a clinic for sprinters focusing on the start and other things. Not sure of the cost, but probably around $20. Again, please get the word out and ask folks to contact me so I can get a head count. Clinic will run from 9:45-10:30.
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