Lyndon Herzberg — superduper WR sprinter or just M55 duper?
Lyndon Herzberg's alter ego?
Say what?
The listed M55 world record for 100 meters is 11.44 by Bill Collins at the 2008 Penn Relays. So Lyndon’s 11.26 (into a slight wind!) must be a new world record!
Or maybe it’s a typo. Or maybe it’s a different Lyndon Herzberg (since the one in the Sacto results is listed as “SR” — for senior in college). Or maybe I’m just really, really confused.
But here’s the disturbing part.
A Lyndon Herzberg is among six men entered in the masters exhibition 100 at the USATF open nationals in Des Moines. His seed time? Yup, 11.26.
A Lyndon Herzberg entered the USATF Southern California Association open meet with an 11.26 seed time. But posted results show no sign of him.
Does he deserve to run in the masters showcase event?
In March 2001, according to these results from the Saddleback Masters Relays in Mission Viejo, California, M45 Lyndon ran the 60-meter dash in 8.85 seconds. That’s not too hot. Even my friend Andy Hecker (with an 8.56) beat him.
And according to 2009 USATF masters rankings, Lyndon ran the 100 at Orange Coast College in 15.04. The race was into a wind, but still. . . . That’s not a typo either. National Masters News carried the same time — 15.04. Check it out.
Did Lyndon really go from 15.04 to 11.26 in one year?
No way, suggests a comment on the letsrun message board, in a different context.
In May 2006, someone posted this comment:
This is a joke, as stated earlier. But the real Speed Kills (the real guy doesn’t use a dash in his name) is a guy named Lyndon Herzberg who used to (until recently) post on these boards, responding with very technical answers to training questions, while also claiming to be a 1:51 800 runner (and some other fast times) at age 53 or so. He was a liar who was revealed to run around 23 minutes for a 5K and 9 seconds for a 60 meter dash, and when called out on this a few months back, did not respond and has not really been seen on the boards since.
In any case, here’s the mysterious 11.26 world record by Lyndon Herzberg on May 9, 2010:
Men 100 Meter Dash
=============================================
Meet Record: M 10.39 5/9/2009 Jason Anthony Heard, E.O.Y.D.C.
Stadium: S 9.91 7/11/2004 Maurice Green, Nike
Name Year School Finals Wind H#
=============================================
1 Johnson, Jody Hornet TC 10.52 -0.4 1
2 Laynes, Jeff Brooks Running 10.65 -0.4 1
3 Billing, Jeff Unattached 10.70 -0.4 1
4 Childs, Wes Unattached 10.73 1.8 2
5 Reed, Albert SR Sacramento State 10.73 -0.4 1
6 Nesbitt, Justin FR Sacramento State 10.84 -0.4 1
7 Wright, David Jon FR Sacramento State 10.92 1.8 2
8 Agyemang, Kwame SR Southern Oregon 10.95 -0.4 1
9 Thigpen, Aaron Unattached 11.02 -0.4 1
10 Fuchs, Josh JR UC Davis 11.11 1.8 2
11 Neely, Robert SO UC Davis 11.17 1.8 2
12 Sena, Kaio FR UC Davis 11.22 1.8 2
13 Herzberg, Lyndon SR Unattached 11.26 -0.4 1
14 Ritchie, Brandon FR Southern Oregon 11.38 3.2 3
15 Creswell, Tyler FR Sacramento State 11.43 3.2 3
16 Tacosa, Ezra FR Academy of Art 11.50 3.2 3
17 Waroff, Alex JR Southern Oregon 11.54 3.2 3
18 Piedad, Erik FR Academy of Art 11.70 3.2 3
As I said: I’m confused.
Someone please straighten me out.
28 Responses
I was hoping to run in Des Moines myself, thanks to the easier qualifying time, but it still proved to be a little too fast for me so I did not enter. With the meet being a few hours away, it would have been a great experience. If this guy shows up now and runs :15, or is a no show, I’m really going to be ticked!
Ken: You are showing here why you deserve the accolades you received on the earlier post. Although I am not going to Des Moines for the nationals, I wondered who this Lyndon Herzberg was (entered in our exhibition 100). I see that you are on the case. All I can say so far is the following:
1. The combination of “Lyndon” and “Herzberg” makes for a very unusual name, which should help the investigation. Can’t recall EVER talking to a boy or man named Lyndon, although I used to watch one on television (Pres. Lyndon Baines Johnson).
2. Based on the listings in the box, if you are shown as SR, FR, SO, or JR you should have a college/university listed as well, not “unattached.” There were 3 other unattached runners in this race (including our very fleet Aaron Thigpen), and none had a grade listed.
Apologies to Mr. Herzberg if he runs well at Drake in the nationals, but I don’t think the apologies will be necessary. Interesting case.
You often see a grade attached to unattached athletes when they are redshirting. However, in my extremely comprehensive database on athletic.net, I have no record of a college athlete by that name,
Maybe he got someone to run for him? I guess we’ll find out in Des Moines.
AH, the REAL value of having Ken on temporary vacation. Go get ’em bulldog!! Love you Ken!! Thanks for all you do for the sport we love!! Bubba
I was reading through old letsrun posts, and it sounds like this guy has quite the imagination regarding his times.
I found this:
He was entered in a 2007 meet at SDSU with a time of 10.37: http://grfx.cstv.com/photos/schools/sdsu/sports/w-track/auto_pdf/AztecInvite07DayTwoHeats.pdf
However, looks like he did not run: http://www.maricopa.edu/cctf/results/track/2007/070317_AztecInvite.html
The Great Gatsby of Masters Track!
Wouldn’t he have been in your age group at one point Marty? Ever seen him?
Something is unusual. Maybe a good athlete not in shape and prone to exaggerate…found results of a sub 21 5K in Colorado and a 25 plus 5K ten years ago but I also found this:
San Diego Association meet RESULTS not a seed time(May 29, 2006)- 11.60 100 meters (no ages are given for the athletes but some masters like Kettrell Berry).
Interesting. Lots of possible explanations.
But even it turns out to be too good to be true, just remove his name from the rankings and let it go. No need to name call.
hay ken where are these guys when nationals and world games come up there are many M50 runners sprinters hurdlers,posting better then ave times but I never see them at big meets with us big boys?
LET ME KNOW IF YOU HAVE ANY REASONS
Mark Cleary, coordinator of the Des Moines masters events, writes:
Ken, he must have entered a phony time. I used to get the applications from the athletes directly — from the athletes to my in box. That was changed about 2 years ago with something National office did to the system.
I only see the posted time and the athlete’s name — not where they ran the time and not if it was a time from this year or last season. The thing that makes it even tougher is that every athlete that does Masters does not put themselves in the rankings; that’s a good place to start to check on an athlete, but not a definitive solution.
I doubt this guy would show up just to get embarrassed. We had a similar situation where a guy talked to John Chaplin, the Men’s Track & Field Chair, and John put him in our exhibition race in New Mexico and he actually showed up and warmed up — but did not show up to the starting line.
That crazy guy was Michael Marin, who lives in the Chicago area last I knew. He has been trying to be a party crasher for years and never has a time that’s even close to being a qualifier.
Thank you for drawing my attention to this. Had we had a full field where bumps needed to be made, he would have been exposed. We are adding Ron Potocnik to the field; he doesn’t show yet, but should by Monday afternoon.
Sounds like Lyndon is pulling a few legs or could there be a Lyndon Herzberg Senior and Junior(father and son)? The times seem to be all over the place, I just jog for fun and can run under 15.0 at 100m.
I run and race in Sacramento and did coach at Sacramento State about 20 years ago. I know the coach and will try to get a rundown on this. I’m turning 50 next month and have NEVER seen nor heard of this individual in middle distance races. I’ve been in some of the best mile masters race going back 10 years and he’s never been in the race. Nothing irks me more than someone who lies about past performances. I’ll see what I can dig up and will post soon.
Hi Ken,
This seems to be a problem, performance inflation. For my 50th birthday I lost some weight and threw shot, discus javelin last year in Osh Kosh Wisconsin. I was world ranked in the decathlon in 1983., so from 79 to 84, made U.S. teams in the decathlon. I ran into a guy at Osh Kosh named Stacy Minge. Tells me he was on the Olympic team with Bruce Jenner in 1980 (by the way, the ding dong had no clue Jenner was done in 1976, nor that the 1980 games were boycotted) He also had no clue having been in the 1984 Olympic trails myself and only mising the 1980 trails by 8 points, I pretty much have a Dustin Hoffman, “Rainmain” memory of not just the decathlon players at the time but can probably site each participants PR in each event, what teams they made, and their U.S. ranking by year from 75-88. The guy was obviously lying., and I was too embarrassed for him to call the fool out. Though, I ALMOST did when he went on to tell me that he also qualified for the Olympic team in the 800 as well. Nice double huh? Maybe he made the team in the hammer too?
What is up with these people and performance inflation. Further, why would anybody feel the need to make up such a story? Really sad is the guy you write about in the above article (11.2 sprinter) who claims he is fast, actually has to show up and prove it.
Mr. Minge and others need to understand the Internet has made the world a much smaller place. Minge went 6,300 or so in college, maybe 6,600. Both very respectable scores. Why fabricate you are an Olympian, those are decent performances.
So heads up everybody, if you go to these national meets, leave your whoppers at home., chances are pretty high if you tell someone at the national meet you were an Olympian, they will most likely know you are full of horse poo. My buddy sitting next to to this guy as he was telling me this was grinning ear to year, knowing that of the 1,000 people at the meet to tell a fib about making the decathlon in the 70’s and 80’s he chose the chose the wrong guy to cast these fibs to. (I had the third highest American Score in 1983) It was hard to not correct the guy, as he spouted his Olmpic team births (two events no less) but I was pretty proud of myself for not feeling he was worth correcting. Figure he missed his prozac that morning or something.
We all get bette with age in our heads to some extent, but I have yet to tell folks I landed on the Moon with Neil Armstrong…(actually I would have been on the moon with him), but NASA made me stay on the mothership and circle the earth waiting for Aldrin and Armstrong to rendezvous. I was only 9 at the time, but took flight lessons when I was young because there was no age limit.
As Jay Leno says, “It’s true…it’s true!”
Lyndon Herzberg has a consistant history of entering big name T&F meets and no-showing. The few I found that Lyndon Herzberg was entered in were on 2/9/08 to compete at the Air Force Academy Indoor Open at Colorado Springs, Co. to run the 60 meters… Of course, he was a No-Show. The 2008 California Invitational Relays the last year it was held in Modesto, before moving to Sacramento, Herzberg was entered in the Masters 100 meters…again, a No-Show. The funniest one to me was his entry time for the Open 100 meters at the 26th Annual Aztec T&F Classic on 3/20/04 with a submited time of 7.24 … yes that’s right … 7.24 seconds…of course, another No-Show. Very, very sad.
Gary,loved your story. Do u remember Tom Harris? We were hs teammates, and i remember him getting into Decathlon in college because he could get more shoe vouchers which he would later sell. He thought it was the best scam going. very funny guy.Turned out to be a pretty good decathlete too.
Hi Bob, Yes, I remember Tom very well. In fact, he was a great decathlete. My freshman year at the NCAA meet Tom was in my heat of the 100 meters at Oregon. Tom beat me well in that race I remember. I also remember, though Tom kind of came up missing on the national scene from 78 to 84, he did in fact place in the top 10 at the Olympic trials in 1984. He was a very good athlete. I remember my freshman year at nationals thinking I will never be as good as these guys. In those days there was no age limit, and Tito Steiner from Argentina was like 31 years old and had been in three Olympics and three Pan Am teams. (at a time when people ran one, and retired) That meet too, if you still see tom, was run at Hayward Field before there were lights. We ran the 1500 meters at 1:30 in the morning (3:30 my eastern time)There were no lights at the stadium so they brought in cars and shined lights on the infield. The other thing I remember about that meet. The large cables from ABC were all over the infield and I had to actually run my approach in the high jump kind of like this…take three steps, jump over a cable, take two,jump over another cable. See if Tom remembers this…In 1978, that track at Eugene was the fastest damn thing I ever ran on. It was made out of a material that was something like this:60 grit sandpaper glued to the surface. It was nothing like they run on today, but I remember it well. Tom was a great all around athlete and great competitor and I was happy to read a few months back when I noticed he placed quite high at the 1984 trials., he deserved it because though not consistently heralded, hew as a great one. Trying to remember Thanks for remembering me Ken., it was great running that master meet last year and running into some old buds.
Crazy!!!! I have a track friend who continues to tell people he ran in the Olympic Trials and I cannot understand why???? He even goes as far as giving the year and everything, but of course no name next to the results on the website.
I guess some individuals enjoy boasting!!!! I say just show up and let your current accomplishments set the stage for what you can do. Too much technology to verify what you boast about.
Great Job Ken!!!!
Gary…do you happen to remember Marty Neibauer, I know he was in the hunt for the trials in 84…he was my high-school coach and is a good friend…
I know of a man telling me incredible times on road races. I checked them and told him I could not find him in the results. After some time he must have been aware that I knew he was lying, but nevertheless he continued. It must be a mess in the head of those individuals…
It’s a old story:
“…a boastful athlete brags that he once achieved a stupendous long jump in competition on the island of Rhodes. A bystander challenges him to dispense with the reports of the witnesses and simply repeat his accomplishment on the spot: “Hic Rhodos, hic salta!”
LOL
If Lyndon actually contributes entry fee money to things like Nationals and these other meets, maybe he can be persuaded to donate LOTS of money, and then he can brag about how much of his income he spends on masters track and field….
Hi Dan,
I do remember the name Marty Niebauer. You have to refresh my memory on him. I THINK he was maybe 3-5 years younger than me though, and I don’t think I competed against him directly. I was injured prior to the 84, Olympic trials and lost my fitness during the rehab., I went anyway to try to do my best,which was not much. I bring that up though because there were like 55 qualifiers for the trials. This was before meets had USATF officials so you had guys at this trails that qualified at meets with names like, Last Chance Underwear Relays, Last Chance Sigmund Noid Relays… I remember Danny Lamp, an 18 foot pole vaulter I NEVER saw in ANY decathlon showes up with a score in the trials at one of these Last Chance Relays meets. There is no way this guy ever finished a decathlon, let alone one at 7,650 that year. Took me 20 decathlons to do this and at the 1984 trials with no officials like today, there were guys I’d never heard of and looked more like hammer throwers (fat, not fit ones) warming up all around me.
I should not be critical of dropouts at that meet (I did reinjure the achelles and calve that had bothered me from the previous year) and was unable to finish. But there had to be more dropped decathletes than any in the history of the decathlon I am sure. There were MANY suspect starts, guys I never heard of. I do NOT believe Marty was part of that group. I remember his as a real deal decathlete., I do think we were just far apart in age, that I may only remember him from the Frank Zarnowski, Deca Newsletters.
Let me know his info an see if I can remember him better. Now you have me thinking.
ON this subject again. It is MIND Boggling what people do. I will not mention a name here, but locally (Michigan area) we had a very successful and respectable coach called out this year at the end of his life and career for claiming all these year he was on the Olympic team with Jesse Owens. It never happened. Mind you, this guy was a LEGITIMATE very good and well loved coach. But, he was an egomaniac too.
I will try to understand this with a quote I heard once from Muhamade (sp?) Ali., “If someone has to tell you he is somebody, he probably is really no one at all?” Might sound weird coming from Ali, but he was SO good he could call himself the greatest of all time. Mainly because he was.
Hi Gary,
Good memories listening to the glory days story of Stacy Minge. He was dressed to the nine in his USA gear and certainly looked the part until he got into the ring.
Hope to see you at a meet soon.
Well, we’re trying to locate a photo of the finish of the 100 meters he ran in Sac. Someone ran 11.26. If he paid someone or had someone else run the time and we have a photo, that should end this.
“It must be a mess in the head of those individuals…”
Yep. These people have to know that in the Internet age, their lies will be quickly and unceremoniously uncovered, so they must at some level be powerless to resist the urge to tell their tall tales. Then there are the people who transcend pathological lying and are (by all appearances) frankly schizophrenic and concoct not merely sham PRs but entire grandiose and obviously false life and athletic histories. It is fascinating, annoying, and sad all at once.
HAY GARY YOU ARE SO RIGHT BRUE JENNER WAS IN THE DEC THAT YEAR ALSO WE ONLY HAD TWO DECATHLETES DUE TO INJURY THE OTHER WAS FRED SUMMARA, WHO IS TO THE DAY HEAD TRACK COACH AT PRINCETON U IN NJ GOOD LOOKING OUT.
Well, Hi Randy Wilson, good to see you are still throwing. I did not look much better than Stacey though. I have to admit, but was happy to be throwing again after 25 years. It really was fun, though I really am just a skinny decathlete under all my fatness…NOT a thrower so keeping up with you big boys is a challenge. (especially with a hernia from my sternum to navel.)
Keith, saw your note. There were three though that made the team in in both 76 and 80, The third was Fred Dixon, who was ranked number one in the world in 1977 just shy of 8,400. Fred Dixon was a great one, made the 1976 team with Fred Samara and Jenner and then made the team in 1980 team that was boycotted by the U.S. (but the trials were still run) From 74 to 84 he had 11 8,000 plus scores (counting his 7,955) The three that made the team in 1980 were Lee Palles, Fred Dixon and Bob Coffman. Fred was poised to make the team again in 1984…fouled three times in the disucs., but did score almost 8100 after a four year plus lay off. Just coincidence, I got to sit with Fred Samara and Fred Dixon a the NCAA meet last year in Arkansas. It was a real hoot. I got to run against Fred Samara’s atheltes at Penn Relays and Fred helped the decatletes on the national teams in 82-84 when I was running well. That was the first time I got to meet Fred Dixon, but he is a real good guy with a great sense of humor. We all had a good laugh about Jenner and the Kardasian show. I saw this week on Rachel Ray Bruce was introduced as, “The Kardasian’s Bruce Jenner.” Proof that glory days pass you buy. It was a thrill for me when Jenner showed up at the 1983 championships at UCLA. He and Fred talked a bit and I tried not to gush when I met him. I got some nice pictures with Jenner and Frank Zarnowski. I should send those to Frank. For decathletes out there that have ever had Frank announce, I swear I alway ran better when Frank announced., it made the meet feel so much more Big time. We all love you FRank Z!!!! Hey keith, are you a decathlete right now (young) or a masters decathlete? Wish I as not so overweight, I would like to do a deca with my son. He long jumped 21 feet as a sophomore and pole vaulted 13. He is doing his first decathlon in a couple weeks in Richmond, Kentucky. He does not have the 400 strength yet, but neither did I at that age. (could not break 57 at age 16. He is a real good athlete so he should do well if he concentrates and chooses to.
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