Facing 4-year ban, Greg Pizza makes call to arms: Fight USADA
My Striders teammate Greg Pizza, 62, reveals in National Masters News that he’s facing a four-year drug ban after testing positive for testosterone at Jacksonville nationals in July. (He was tapped after taking third in the 100.) In a Times of San Diego article posted Wednesday night, I added the NMN piece as well as his responses to other questions. I’m still awaiting a reply from USADA to Greg’s call for giving masters athletes a break. I also wrote USATF Masters Chairman Gary Snyder for comment. I salute NMN publisher Amanda Scotti for featuring this controversial topic. Greg is her boyfriend, but she exposes him to potentially harsh judgment. So sad that the year masters outdoor nationals is skedded for Michigan, a native of that state won’t compete in Grand Rapids.
Greg, in the shades, sprints with red-wearing Striders teammates.
When time allows, I’ll post my email Q&A with Greg PIE-za. But here’s a highlight:
Masterstrack.com: Despite your arguments, with doctor’s support, you will still be accused of doping with intent to gain an advantage. How do you respond to such suspicions?
Greg Pizza: I have learned a lot since July — the big thing is that this topic of HRT, hormone replacement therapy, is a very misunderstood topic. A lot of people are very misinformed.
Ever since I began the threrapy, over two years ago, I have been continually and closely monitored by Dr. [Jonathan] Kalman so that we know what my levels are and ensure they they do not rise above or fall too far below the range he suggests they be.
I understand that many, many people do not understand the reasons and benefits of testosterone therapy beyond the generic “it builds bigger muscles” mentality.
If a person is still young enough to have sufficient levels in their system, they would have no reason to find out more about it. I think the simplest way to put this is that testosterone simply wears out — just like joints, in older athletes.
Testosterone levels are easily testable by a blood test; there is a range of normalcy established by the medical community. How is it any different than replacing a worn-out knee? It is only labeled cheating because drugs which can be performance enhancing to elite level athletes or athletes, who don’t need them, are banned across the board for all age groups.
This https://tramadolbest.com/tramadol-100mg/ drug was prescribed to my grandmother during the autumn- spring exacerbation of her leg disease.
Masters are different, and the rules relating to these substances should be as well.
This is a health issue that many of us are or will be dealing with, not performance enhancing.
67 Responses
No testosterone in masters athletics.
The article in Times of San Diego attributed to you states that David Pain founded Masters Track & Field in the Sixties. May I respectfully point out that the Veterans Athletic Club was founded in London in 1931 and was the first Club devoted solely to athletes aged 40-plus.
I am sure he is totally innocent
Warning – this is a long and very honest comment.
I’m 55 years old and post-menopausal. I began experiencing my first menopause symptoms around age 50, and I honestly didn’t think they were too bad. However things quickly “got real”- 2013 and the first few months of 2014 were a horrible time for me as I went through the worst of menopause. Due to a strong family history of breast and reproductive cancers I was not a good candidate for any type of HRT (estrogen, estro-progesterone, or androgen, banned or not) so I navigated menopause “med-free.”
I’m so glad it’s done – it was bad.
I’m aware that menopause is something that every woman of certain years will experience. It’s not life-threatening by any means. However my enjoyment of life was greatly decreased during that 15 month period. I was also diagnosed with hypothyroidism during that time and suffered an Achilles tendon tear in early 2013. Menopause, an underactive thyroid, and inactivity due to injury caused me to gain close to 20 lbs. with most of concentrated in my torso. My children had all gone on to college or work and the “empty nest syndrome” left me depressed. I had night sweats, sometimes up to 5 or 6 times each night. I would have hot flashes at work which left me panting and mildly disoriented. My inactive thyroid led to such symptoms as flaky skin, thinning hair at the temples, and recurring constipation. I was once vibrant and energetic but menopause left me feeling tired and old. Any man or woman who has the option of HRT during their aging years is fortunate. I wouldn’t wish my experience on anyone.
My doctor recently recommended a medication called Raloxifene which reduces the risk of breast cancer in post-menopausal women. Unfortunately it’s also a banned drug so I don’t take it. Sure, I could take it and not participate in masters track, however my doctor also strongly recommends that I continue with my high level of physical activity in order to keep my muscle and bone mass high, for cardiovascular health, and for a healthy level of body fat. For those of you who say, “just find another activity to do!” how many times have you seen overweight people joylessly slogging it out in the gym? In order to truly commit to a fitness program you need to find an activity that engages every part of you, and for me that is track. The happiness I get while competing in my favorite sport is my motivator to stay fit. Raloxifene would help reduce my risk of a serious disease. Track also helps reduce my risk of a serious disease.
It’s just too bad that I have to make a choice between the two of them.
Brave comment, Liz. You’re not alone, I’m sure.
Wish some commenters at Track & Field News had the same grown-up attitude:
http://trackandfieldnews.com/discussion/showthread.php?148058-M60-sprinter-facing-4-year-drug-ban-challenges-USADA-to-fix-rules
I suggest that we have races for those that do steroids and one for those that don’t. Fair, enough?
Agree with comment 1 from Anthony Treacher. Was Greg unaware that testosterone (which I think must be the best known of all the prohibited substances) was on the prohibited list?, it appears that your respondent #3 believes this to be the case. Athletics is undoubtedly a major part of Greg’s life and contributes to his wellbeing but the fact remains that testosterone is a banned substance and, however unpalatable that is, if Greg was aware he should not have been competing.
From reading the Times article, it sounds like Greg knew that he was using a prohibited substance but felt that it did not give him an unfair advantage so thought that it was ok. I do think that it is admirable that he readily admits that he took the drug and will accept his penalty unlike so many who get caught and have all kinds of excuses. Should the drug program for masters be changed? Probably but until then, we do have to follow the rules.
Nicely expressed, Liz (comment 4). I am reminded of a conversation I had with the physician who was my “boss” in the late 1970s and early 1980s. “REC” had been chair of pediatrics at Johns Hopkins and then had moved to the University of Wisconsin before becoming the president of my institution.
REC recalled for me that in the early years, children were considered by physicians to be “little adults.” The idea that they somehow merited an entirely different branch of medicine (pediatrics) was apparently resisted.
Today, can you imagine a 9-year-old child presenting to a physician with compromised cardiac function being evaluated and treated the same way as one of our 82-year-old javelin throwers? Of course not.
Although sprinters Bob Lida (79) and Irene Obera (82) are elite in the dictionary sense (“the best of a class”), they are not elite athletes in the T&F sense (the top open athletes).
A reasonable conclusion from your comment, Liz, is that we need another look at masters athletics that considers drug use in the context of clinical, social, and behavioral issues. We are not young; we need our own rules.
I no longer compete, nor have I had to face any decisions regarding use of therapeutic or any other kinds of banned drugs.
But . . . I have a question for those well-informed: If (1) a masters athlete is faced with having to decide to take a banned drug that is prescribed and recommended by his/her physician as a result of a medical condition, (2) the use of that drug has a finite timeline after which the drug will no longer be administered, and (3) that athlete decides NOT to compete during this time, does the athlete still have to be concerned about being tested and risking disqualification?
Since I’m the guy on the right of Greg in the post I’m going to throw in my two cents. Greg is my teammate and friend. He is the closest competitor to me in the world in my age division, and the one who beat me out of that bronze medal that he was drug tested for. More than anyone, you would think that I would be concerned about him beating me because of this substance issue.
For you individuals that commented on this post saying the rules are what there are must not require anything to improve their quality of life as of yet. Arm chair quarterbacks is what I’m detecting here. Easy to say but hard to experience if its about you. I’m sure if the shoe were on the other foot, and you were given the choice to live a quality life, or compete, which would you choose. Especially when you are an athlete like Greg who has been competing for most of his life in Track and Field.
First I want to make a disclaimer here, I am President of the Southern California Striders track club and any opinions or comments made by me are by me and in no way reflect the position or opinion of any member, or board member of the Striders organization.
As Masters Athletes we are not professional athletes, most of us do not receive any kind of real sponsorship. We pay for our own way to meets, sometimes costing us thousands of dollars. We do it so that we may claim small medals to show our accomplishments. Anyone over 50 will tell you that just getting out and training is a chore in itself. Now being asked to sacrifice a quality of life so that we can spend all of this money to race for a small medal, obviously has blinders on.
Another question that I have is, is this random drug testing really conducted correctly. Why aren’t the winners of the events drug tested. Why was Greg selected for the drug test when he won the bronze in the 100 at this National meet. That one has me scratching my head. I’m sure that they have some kind of protocol and procedure to follow, but it just seemed odd that Greg was pulled out of the pack.
All that said, I am sure there will be negative responses to my post, but unless you fully understand the ramifications and implications of all this, the statement “It is what it is” is moronic! and will go on deaf ears…
There are situations where ignoring a physicians advice about taking a banned substance can be detrimental to your health. There needs to be some allowance for this as long as levels are kept in a normal range. If this is monitored by a physician and levels are normal this is not performance enhancing over a subject that already maintains normal levels. We could say it levels the playing field. Of course anyone caught with elevated levels of, for instance, testosterone should be banned.
1 Why not say: I love athletics and I love competition, but as I have a prescription for a banned substance I do not want to have medals, prizes etcetera.
2 The tricky word is ‘normal’. Compared to what? Compared to your younger self? Compared to the level of age class record holders? Compared to the general public of the same age?
I guess I can bring some enlightenment to the discussion. I was diagnosed with an extremely low testosterone count, almost zero. What are the consequences? Naturally, your partner will be unhappy as will you, that one we all know and concentrate on. What was equally or, in my case, more problematic were the other side effects of an extremely low count, cognitive decline and impairment, memory loss and spatial disorientation. I went to my doctor, got tested, was asked about family history… and my doctor put his foot down. #@$% your sport, he said, you will develop dementia without that stuff in your veins. No discussions, period.
That was that. Next thing, I applied for a TUE, got in touch with our drug lords and was told in person that they would not issue a TUE for testosterone, period. No matter how bad it would be, it would not be bad enough. Find other activities, I was told, take up golfing. And, by the way, we are going to look out for you should you plan to compete. #@$% you too, I said.
I went on the stuff, my condition improved greatly… and I went off testosterone to compete. Obviously, the draw of my beloved sport was greater than concerns for my health. And the symptoms returned. Spatial disorientation greatly helped me to run into a hurdle at the US Nationals last year. My life turned a bit crazy, mental fogginess/fuzziness, difficulty concentrating, a pending divorce (not caused by my condition, I think)… it became too much. I’m running a company and few hundred jobs depend on me being at my mental best. Early December of 2015 I crawled back to my physician and I’m on a testosterone treatment now. I’m being tested every 4 to 6 weeks to keep the count in the lower region of ‘normal’ and there is hope my body can restart production down the road, God know.
For now, my dear friends, you will have to compete without me. Can’t say I’m happy, I’m #@$%@#. and still too young to take up golfing.
Stefan
Thank you for your story. This is the message that needs to get out to the USATF and USADA. Are they going to force us to divorce ourselves from organized USATF events and create our own Masters organization to compete in. That’s not as hard as it sounds. It’s all about insurance and I am sure that there are insurance carriers out there that would be more than happy to insure events. Just a thought.
Have we become so callous that when quality, honest people like Greg Pizza and Liz Palmer have to choose between a doctor prescribed medication and competing as a masters athlete, some people can say, “too bad, nothing to see here, move along.” Obviously there are many questions about the fairness of the rules regarding this situation. My question is why are the people running the USATF Masters not coming to the aid of their members? What is their position on this issue? What are they doing to help? Isn’t this part of their job? If not, what exactly is their job? A little transparency please!
I appreciate your comment, Bert. I can’t emphasize enough how different we are from open athletes. According to the CDC (Centers for Disease Control and Prevention), in 2014, 1.5% of the civilian, non-institutionalized U.S. population aged 0-44 had diabetes. What about the population aged 65-74?
Well, CDC says that in 2014, 21.5% of that group had diabetes. More generally, we must consider that many of our W/M 65-69 and W/M 70-74 athletes are likely to have multiple health concerns, especially those who have diabetes.
I’m in favor of new rules for those aged 35+_ beginning next month, although I won’t volunteer to be on the committee.
Stefan, thank you for your interesting (and poignant) story in post no. 14. I’ll miss you, as you’re a good guy, and funny as well.
I will add my vote to those advocating for a healthier policy for Masters athletes. I am a doctor (snd knew Dr. Cooke, Peter), but that doesn’t give me any extra credibility, other than to emphasize what most of you already know and have said here – that many of the banned substances are essential for health in people our age. That is the presumed purpose of a TUE, but Stefan’s experience is evidence that the TUE process is broken (cheers, Stefan – I hope there is a way to get you back out on the track). I would not advocate different rules, just a much more enlightened use of the TUE process. For example, I don’t know of a medical reason for a woman to take testosterone, so you can’t just take that off the list. But I also don’t know of a reason for a man to live with a level below what is the lower limit of normal for his age group. A TUE should be granted to any male with a doctor’s order, but testing should also be done – both for fairness and for his health – to be sure his levels are not above the normal range for age. Other drugs, such as those for hypertension or diabetes, may not be easy to monitor by blood levels, but they aren’t particularly performance-enhancing either, so a TUE should be granted if there is proper medical documentation.
I would much rather compete against a healthy Stefan whose testosterone level is now the same as mine than to never get a chance to run with him again.
Difficult problem that the medical community has not entirely come to grasp completely. What is normal testosterone at a given age is not well defined. Testosterone declines as we all age and that is natural. What some may consider symptoms of low T, others just chalk up to normal aging.
How do we know how much T to prescribe, at what point do the anabolic advantages begin to manifest themselves, I know of no test where one can predict at what Testosterone level an individual will have only positive results for symptoms like decreased libido and energy and have no obvious advantageous androgenic results.
If one were to grant a TUE based on a given dosage of Testosterone which put the athlete into some accepting level, how would could we be sure the individual is not taking more than the prescribed amount and definitely getting adding androgenic advantages.
Testosterone no matter at what dose does offer the user advantages, we have seen at all levels of competition. Running Masters track is not a right it is a choice, I for one want to compete in a drug free sport.
Allan, it is entirely possible to set a definition for the normal range of testosterone level at any given age group. Let athletes know that in advance. Let them know that they will be tested and if their level is above the upper limit of normal as previously defined, they will be disqualified. Suggest that for their own health as well as to avoid disqualification that they get tested on a regular basis on whatever dose their doctor recommended to be sure that when they compete they will be “legal”. At that point, you can be sure that you will not be competing against anyone with excessive levels of testosterone in their blood. Isn’t that more fair than the current situation, where my normal testosterone levels give me a competitive advantage over someone’s levels that are low through no fault of their own? Although Bubba Sparks will always be able to vault several feet higher than me even with no testosterone to work with.
This has been an interesting discussion. I’m 49 heading to 50. Without blood measurements, my feeling is that if I don’t train, my testosterone level is fairly normal. I know this because of not exercising after hernia repair surgery last fall. However my stress level and usually my weight increase when I stop running. But when I train at a high level, the reverse happens. I suppose I could take testosterone and have the best of both worlds, but I choose not to.
Bob you are wrong because it is arbitrary, and this would lead to not only urine testing but blood testing for testosterone levels. So what will the level be, will we be allowing everyone up to a certain level, so for argument sake at 55 my present age we set the range that Greg’s doctor stets is normal, 500-700, well my present level is now below this, having been tested, so do I get to supplement to increase my level to the upper limits of normal? This is a problem that we really do not have the answers or the true normative values for individuals, as well we all do not react the same to endogenous testosterone, and we certainly do not know when the true anabolic, muscle building properties become predominant.
From what I’ve read; it seems that we need a distinction between rules for Masters athletes and Elite athletes. I do know that at some point, most of us will need to take a banned substance just to be able to compete. Personally, when I reach that point, I will retire from Masters track. For everyone else; if they have a prescription for anything banned and have notified USATF about it, let them compete with it (NO RECORDS). As for medals like in Gregs case — Bronze for Greg and Bronze for Joe. I know that this is not totally fair but it is also unfair to deny and suspend them as well.
Do the TUE evaluators work with the athletes doctor for a healthy alternative?
I agree with Allen.
I’m over 50 and have never had my levels tested. I also feel we are over medicated and I hope I will not need to be on testosterone. If I need to be on a banned substance that a Tue is not allowed for, then I will run for the health benefits and not compete.
People are sticking their heads in the sand, if they think taking testosterone is not a performance enhancer.
Liz’s comments above and Greg’s article in National Masters News put very human faces to the complexity of issues inherent in drug testing for Masters Athletes.
The number of comments that are generated every time drug testing is a topic in Ken’s blog suggests that there is no easy answer.
But the answer is not to ignore the issue until more and more Masters are banned and the sport finally dies under the weight of this resolvable issue.
Greg’s forthrightness in placing this issue squarely into a spotlight is to be applauded. Hopefully, the powers that be will finally recognize that Masters ARE a different breed of athletes than their younger counterparts and adjust drug testing protocols accordingly.
The hysteria surrounding drug use in Masters smacks of witch-hunting. Months ago, when the entire Russian Masters team was banned (without testing) from this year’s Worlds because of the actions of some of their younger counterparts, one would think we were living back in the 1950s.
Unfortunately the answer is going to be complex. There are legitimate medical issues which must be considered but also appear to be people who look for possible loopholes and some who just cheat and will try to play the system to gain an advantage for or otherwise. Given the range of medical issues and treatments available that can have a positive affect on performance maybe the only solution is to accept drug use. World records would be meaningless but since we do this for fun does it really matter?
I’m on HRT and compete in All Comer meets. I don’t like being on HRT, but it’s much greater than the symptoms I was having due to low testosterone. I am monitored by a MD and he makes sure I stay in the(admittedly arbitrary) normal range.
I’m not taking any places or medals away from anyone because they are not tracked or given out to begin with. There’s no drug testing, so no one will even ever know.
I love the sport so much, I would really hate to stop competing completely.
Wonder what’s Stanislaw Kowalski’s
Testosterone levels are?
I agree, in principal, that Masters need less stringent drug rules than Olympians. But if you think USATF will ever address this, forget it ! Masters USATF members are merely a source of revenue. They will never address a “Masters” set of drug rules.
I agree with Chuckxc that USATF will never address a “Masters” set of drug rules. Too busy with other, more pressing matters.
I know I will get hopped for making this naive suggestion, but what about getting rid of mandatory drug testing for Masters and instituting a voluntary program?
If a Masters athlete sets an AR or WR and wants it go into the record books unasterisked, he or she voluntarily submits to a drug test and pays for it. If he or chooses not to be drug tested, it goes into the record books with an asterisk as untested record. And get rid of banning and treating people like criminals.
At least something to consider since the problem isn’t going to go away on its own.
Rob, you may be on to something there. I was told by a doctor that my hypertension and extreme fatique was probably a result of my low testosterone. I also have a hypothyroid condition and have to take synthroid and Liothyronine for that. Is that considered performance enhancing? My thyroid barely functions. If I were told that I have to stop taking my thyroid medication in order to compete then it would effectively end my competition, because I would not be even able to drag myself to the track without it. By the same token people who have not suffered from low testosterone, not low normal, have no place offering an opinion on the subject. There should be a level playing field. It is not a level field when a person suffering from low testosterone is having to compete with others who have normal or even low normal. The knife cuts both ways.
Any non US citizen can enter one of our national championships. However, they cannot medal, displace an American or receive prize money.
Seems to me like this is the way to go. If you need a TUE or a banned substance for legitimate health reasons then go ahead and take them but you must declare it if you intend to compete and therefore be ineligible for a medal or any record you might set. Sounds simple.
I for one would like to know that when I come up into the start position that when I glance left and right that it is a level (think no drugs) playing field. If you truly have a passion for this sport and you honestly want or need to improve your health by doing it, but need a banned substance to do it then by all means please continue. Lord knows we need more people not less.
All you would need to do would be to check your ego at the door, make your declaration and race…but technically not against me. I would be totally down with that. Wouldn’t you?
I have no personal experience with any type of hormone replacement therapies and my knowledge is all gained from the personal experiences of those here and what I read elsewhere about other athletes who used it. For those of us who love our sport and need it to compete, I do understand that most likely the intention was not to hurt others…only to have a chance to keep going themselves. I suppose what I do have a problem with is an individual who is healthy and takes HgH or HRT to become elevated to a new level such as for a world record or a #1 ranking This is the intention of why the rules are enforced.
One of the most publicized sports that recently banned testosterone shots was the UFC. The biggest names who had used it were Vitor Belfort, Chael Sonnen and Dan Henderson. When they were on it, everyone knew just by looking at their chiseled physiques and how they physically dominated champion quality fighters. Once it got banned, they were the ones being dominated and Sonnen just quit saying he can’t compete anymore. The other two have barely won a match between them so it is obvious it works to improve performance and these guys are in their 30’s.
The question that we all can ask ourselves is: Does receiving the shots allow me to improve my performance? or not? The reason younger athletes take it is because they know it does and often by a substantial amount.
Older athletes naturally through the aging process continue to lose testosterone every year. It would be interesting to see a test group of 90 year olds take a series of shots to bring their levels to 700 or whatever number feels right and monitor their times and distances. I think we can guess that suddenly having these levels would change their athletic lives noticeably.
So I can see why that those with low or no testosterone would have little chance in the first place competing in certain events anymore. It is a dilemma that involves further discussion for us masters.
I like Max’s suggestion (#33).
First, I’d like to echo the sentiments of Bert Bergen(#16), and I’d like to think that the comments of chuckxc(#30) are less than accurate. (probably wishful thinking on my part) But let’s be realistic, we are getting old. Stuff happens to us as we age. We can’t take the perspective of “that which is not My problem is not A problem”. The medals are fine, the winning or doing well is very nice. Even the hard training and pain can (at times) be fun. But honestly, what difference does it all make? Years from now we will have medals and hopefully memories of these days. And isn’t that what we really do this for; the camaraderie, the health benefits and the overall quality of our lives? Perhaps if I didn’t know Greg or enjoy running and competing with him… would I have a different attitude? I doubt it. A few years ago I ran into him at a meet and he hadn’t been competing for a while. I could see there was a problem, but I didn’t know him well enough to talk to him about it. When he came back it enhanced the quality of our sport. This is an issue that we need to get into and fix. We want to encourage the growth of master’s track, not stifle it. The generations behind us are going to need it.
Ryan Hall, who is only 33, stopped running because he thought that taking drugs to combat his low T levels and competing were antithetical to each other.
It seems to me, that if you know that what you are taking is banned, but still compete you have an ethical as well as a medical problem.
I have never heard so much absolute bullshlt. The only posts here that deserve respect are those decrying the use of androgens, and those describing voluntary withdrawal from USATF competition.
“Quality, honest people” Are you people nuts?
I should look up the ages of all the apologists here. I’m sure this is a mentality specific to a particular stunted generation.
No, I’m not kidding. You people make me sick with your narcissism and apology therefor.
I said it in another thread: you don’t like it, get lost. Compete in the Senior Games or elsewhere. You don’t need USATF. If you think you do, you’re wrong. If there are no other meets in the wilderness in which you live, then organize your own. Find your own sandbox to play in. No doubt yours will be the one containing the cat feces.
Please let this post endure, Ken. It’s a genuine expression of my disgust and ire at the well-documented self-absorption of your generation.
Oh, look–there’s that apostrophe again! Let the flame begin. I might actually stay here to battle it out. If I sound disrespectful, it is because I am. These pro-drug and pro-self attitudes are unworthy of my respect.
When I said: “I am sure he is totally innocent” I was being sarcastic. Every time somebody is caught taking drugs he/she has a great excuse why they are innocent. I should have known that sarcasm is lost on master athletes. https://www.theguardian.com/science/shortcuts/2016/jan/12/sarcasm-over-65-scientific-study-older-people
I’m OK with Max’s suggestion too I think.(#33)
Matthew (#28) (probably not your real name and I know a couple runners similar to you that only compete in all-comers now in their 50’s). Your performances still get listed in masters rankings. Also those age group competitors in that all-comers don’t know you are on HRT.
Milan (#38) That was point – sarcasm. When I mentioned soon to be 106 year old Stanislaw Kowalski
It doesn’t matter what his levels are. He isn’t asking his doctor to check, in fact his advice was to stay away from doctors period.
If he raced the other 105 year old Japanese athlete Hidekichi Miyazaki and found out he was on HRT- would he care? I mean what is the normal free testosterone level for a 105+ year old?
At some point the “normal” range is giving athletes a boost no doubt about it. If an athlete was racing well but decided to have his levels checked and found out that his was in the normal range but below the top level,could he still use supplementation to raise up his levels without going over the top limit for someone his age? If so, what the heck let’s all start getting some added T!
Milan, I got it but then I am just 66. I suspect that the big problem is that until recently, there was almost no drug testing done for masters events so no one had to worry. I don’t have a problem with a rule change for masters athletes and maybe they should be changed but until then we do have to follow what requirements we do have.
Mike Walker – I agree
I find it fascinating that “a Masters runner” does not need his name.
I think that the person that should “get lost” is the one that did not have the guts or the integrity to post his name with his.comments.
Agree with Max:
“If you need a TUE or a banned substance for legitimate health reasons then go ahead and take them but you must declare it if you intend to compete and therefore be ineligible for a medal or any record you might set. Sounds simple.”
And agree with Rob Jerome on use of asterisks 🙂
Like Max, I would like to know whether I am competing against pharmaceutically-aided athletes. At the very least, anyone with a TUE should have to declare it and be asterisked in the results. We don’t need to know what the TUE is for.
It is worth considering that we have people who would not be able to train, let alone compete, without their daily dose of no-TUE required anti-hypertensive, statins, anti-depressants, pain-killers or whatever. These are all performance-enhancing if the athlete can’t compete without them, but the doping regs make a hypocritical, illogical distinction in allowing these without discussion.
There is NO difference in my mind between someone taking these “everyday” drugs and someone taking testosterone to get their levels up to the point where they can function as a human being again, and the anti-doping authorities should recognise that you can’t possibly treat over-50s in the same way as elite “kids”.
BTW, according to a Mayo Clinic report (http://newsnetwork.mayoclinic.org/discussion/nearly-7-in-10-americans-take-prescription-drugs-mayo-clinic-olmsted-medical-center-find/) : “Nearly 70% of Americans are on at least one prescription drug, and more than half take two… 20% of patients are on five or more prescription medications”.
That is the culture of pharmaceutical-dependence our sport is embedded in. Given those figures, how many of those competing in masters track and field are pharmaceutically-aided, if not pharmaceuticals-dependent? Do we know how many TUEs are in circulation? Do we have ANY data on drug use to present to USADA or WADA to help make a case that over-50s need different doping regulations than those designed to catch 20-something elites winning $500,000 in marathons and chasing $millions in sponsorship deals at championship events?
As far as raising T levels to “normal”: as others have pointed out, it is impossible to know what “normal” is for an individual, UNLESS we follow the incredibly espensive route now in place in professional cycling, where every competitor has to have a biological passport that establishes baseline levels, and be regularly tested. The dope testers don’t measure levels of testosterone against some hypothetical normal value, they measure the testosterone to epitestosterone ratio. (I wonder whether Greg’s doctor knew to run that test, which would have kept Greg out of trouble). The testers presumably go on and find out if the T involved is synthetic.
As far as
The level that you are at is the normal level for you. Everyone is different. I think that’s the point. Everyone declines at a different rate-what’s normal for one individual is not normal for another so there is no real way to be fair in regards to allowing testosterone supplementation. I think Dr. Tissenbaum described the complexities of the issue best. A few of the ideas voiced here were interesting. I still think our national meets and records need to be protected with testing. I think the records idea of anyone wanting to have their record recorded would submit to a voluntary drug test would be one way to make sure the integrity of our records stay intact. Some of the Region Championships will have random testing in 2016.The system is not perfect, but for the time being it is what we have to work with.
Just so I am clear, my doctor advises me to take HRT for health reasons. I choose not to because I still want to be able to compete legally. I do,however, understand the other side of the issue because my health has suffered as a result. Those who are dealing with low levels, again not low normal, are at a disadvantage. The playing field is not now, nor has it ever been, level.
How courageous of anonymous # 37 to say he “might stay to battle it out” from his dark little hiding place .
Simon, USADA gave me numbers on TUEs granted in 2014 for all sports and all ages:
http://masterstrack.com/usada-approved-only-275-tues-for-all-sports-all-ages-in-2014/
I am am very fortunate to be able to compete. If my health dictates that I am no longer able to compete within the rules, I will move on. No ifs, ands, or buts!
My suggestion is: Health before competition. If you need medication then take it. You can still work out, compete at smaller competitions. I personally dislike competitions because the disrupt my work out schedule :-).
OK. Full disclosure. Up until my heart attack (ambulance ride and 95% blockage in the “widow make” due to bad family genetics and one $50,000 stent later) on Feb. 3, 2015, I was on nothing. Now:
81 mg Aspirin
75 mg Cloidogrel
5.0 mg Lisinopril
25 mg metroprolol
80 mg atrovastatin
I ran this through the USADA website and they all turned up negative. From personal experience I can attest the above medication is performance reducing (certainly not performance enhancing) as medication designed to reduce your blood pressure, reduce your heart rate, and thin your blood, is not conducive to sprinting. I used to do workouts when my heart rate dropped to 120. Now I can’t get my heart rate above 120. Perhaps I need a TUE to have a medical age-graded factor added in. Any ideas for those of us with performance reducing drugs???
I thought that we were all training hard so that we could be happy, healthy, and not dependent on prescription medications. Also, none of the posts here mention the litany of side effects that testosterone use/abuse can cause or contribute to…
testicular atrophy
erectile dysfunction
prostate issues (BPH &cancer)
increased LDL
heart wall thickening
heart enlargement
stroke
polycythemia
acne
sebaceous cysts
body hair changes (too much and/or too little)
Also, no mention of androgen receptors. Some people with low-T or other hormone deficiencies are functionally healthy because their androgen receptors have adapted to lower levels and become more sensitive. This scenario is why SERMS & SARMS are banned PED’s.
Nicely stated, David Ortman (post 52). You and I are similar in that we both ran for small colleges (you in Kansas and I in Pennsylvania) and have been training for many years as adults.
I work out aerobically 42 minutes a day, 7 days a week, and have been training steadily for the last 40 years, even though I haven’t run a race in more than 11 years.
I have a low resting pulse and other indicators of my very good condition. Currently I take two drugs for blood pressure and one for my lipids as well as a big aspirin. I haven’t checked as to whether my drugs are illegal, because I don’t intend to race again.
Your post, David, indicates that one or more of my drugs would be unacceptable. This speaks to the larger issue that I raised earlier. Most masters athletes are in great shape, but a lot of them take physician-prescribed drugs to reduce their risk of stroke, heart attack, etc.
Is reducing my risk of stroke (I’ve had two in my lifetime) through drugs a form of performance enhancement? As you suggest, it may be performance reducing.
@#43, Damien, who do you think has the availability to enter in this conversation without a name? Somebody who likes to instigate negative criticism to prolong and get more responses to a story?
A great discussion. i have a suggestion. And this is just concerning Testosterone…I am certain there will be other Drugs which will be addressed since technology is changing so rapidly. I for one think we need a age level testosterone range ( and yes, I did my homework–I called the Salt Lake City WADA lab and spoke at length to the dr. in charge, he assured me that the numbers are available to determine such a level playing field)–and as a matter of fact encouraged me to continue to speak out as he agreed that Masters should not be treated as elite athletes)..Allow the low T athlete to receive HRT and run in our ( USA ) National meets. IF he or she ( yes I know women who take testosterone as well ) medals and is tested and found to be above the age normal , that is a simple DQ, no need to put a senior through a ‘shaming’ ala Scarlet T on their chest ..just hold the medals for that particular race until the test results are back and then award them accordingly. The athlete has to go back to his dr. to get his levels back to where they should be in order to compete again. I do not know of one athlete who wants to go thru that more than once.. I can assure everyone that the dr. and the athlete should want to comply. This idea that we are to be treated as Elite athletes doesn’t wash in this day and age. Lets grow this sport not start to shut off those who love it. USATF has the ability to change rules for National competitions–not International or WMA events…I really wonder if anyone there really cares?
Don Schaefer (#56) a voice of reason, and thank goodness someone who did some research. Thank you! There have been too few of us who have put forth reasoned opinions backed by critical thought and fact. We have too many people commenting here with a knee-jerk reaction based on even less information and fact than found in a 15 second political sound bite.
I have read numerous posts about those who may have tested positive. This is not an USATF responsibility and it is not a Masters Executive Committee responsibility. Oversight is strictly assigned to USADA on a domestic level and to WADA for international competition. I think it would be better to educate your friends as to the testing criteria and avoid a controversy where your comments are going to be of little value. As to comments trying to compare enhanced T as a panacea to avoid marriage dissolution, I think you need to practice matrimonial law for a while and see how many times that is raised as a reason for the break up.
Sounds reasonable to me Don. You have a grasp of the situation.
Sounds like a bunch of excuses to take drugs to me. If you have medical problems take up ballet or basket weaving. These are the same type of excused that were claimed in Track & Field, baseball and tennis over the years. We need to test 1st 2nd and 3rd place finishers at every meet! Lets make sure its fair and clean.
Fascinating discussion. In my opinion, none of this sounds like an excuse to take drugs. It’s people who are passionate about track and field facing the heart-breaking loss of no longer being able to compete due to illness. They’re not trying to defy the rules; they’re trying to defy an illness. Masters athletes naturally test their limits. But allowing athletes who use testosterone or other banned substances to compete would be a slippery slope. Not everyone is honest, and the problem could potentially ruin the sport.
I’ll never get 1st, 2nd or 3rd. Go ahead and test!
well, aging is not for sissies – as somebody else said…
It’s been quite an interesting run through the forest in the trees to Granny’s House of TUES the last few weeks. For many masters some comments are too cold, some are too hot and some are just right. In the story we learned that Greg Pizza needs a TUE for testosterone and “A Master’s Runner” needs a TUE for chill pills. The moral of the story is that whether it is in the woods, or on the track, grass, or road, just keep running because it is good for what ails you.
I wish the phrase “level playing field” were a banned substance.
The concept is false if for no other reason than genetics.
Let’s imagine, for the fun of it, someone with the genetic disorder that reduces the production of myostatin. Myostatin limits muscle growth, so those with this actual disorder, pack on muscle with greater ease than those without it.
When someone with this disorder shows up to race, or at a powerlifting or bodybuilding competition, the field becomes instantly un-level.
But, of course, there are no rules prohibiting this person from competing.
I, like many other masters sprinters, was the fastest kid in school from the time I was in kindergarten until high school… just by pure accident of fate. I was also an undefeated gymnast for the 6 years I was in middle and high school. Total fluke that I was built for gymnastics and, by even greater accident, went to a middle school where the gym teacher was a former world champion tumbler.
When I was on the track or on the mat, there was no level playing field. The people that eventually beat me, were bigger genetic and circumstantial freaks than I was.
I’m not suggesting a free-for-all with regard to HRT and TUEs. I’d just like to remove the fictional angle of the playing field as point of debate.
As a masters, you dont get paid, you only pay out. So I say take whatever you want and have fun. If your get caught, c=run under another name. WHo really gives a F?
I’m British and I have never heard of anyone over here having low testosterone or having it topped up by a doctor. It seems to be an American disease, treatment or both. Maybe an artefact of us having state-paid medicine. Then again, we are “veterans”, with its connotations of old, limping and decrepit, rather than glamorous rebranded “masters” 😉
There is a huge flaw in any system which allows you to supplement, and to turn up with a certain testosterone level at competition. How long before people just take 5x that dose all winter and just tail it off before competition to squeeze into that normal range? I bet the main villains would be from countries that think taking lots of pills is normal.
Testing is expensive, testing is rare in Masters meetings (even at World level), and out-of-competition testing and bio passports just are not going to happen at masters level.
I agree that TUEs would be a good way to go, and that people with conditions should be allowed treatment to restore some kind of normal function. But we need some special voluntary board of doctors to administer and review these – not just any doctor – otherwise people will queue up to see whoever is willing to stretch the rules most.
I would also fully support people on medication taking part in road races and open meetings, as long as they check some box to say they are on medication which would disqualify them from winning any age group prizes. We are here to encourage sport and activity.
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