Open lanes at open nationals? Masters events in jeopardy
Will the men’s masters exhibition 60 and women’s 400 at USATF open indoor nationals have empty lanes? That seems to be the worry of Mark Cleary, organizing these races at the AT&T indoor championships Feb. 23-24 in Boston. On Friday, he sent this note to Mary Rosado, who is organizing the masters relays events at Millrose: “Mary, would you please get the word out to these teams that we still need competitors for the Open Indoor National Masters Invitational event–Men’s 60m dash and Women’s 400m all athletes must be at least 40 and the women’s time standard is 65 seconds and the Men’s time standard is 7.33 for 40-49 and 7.36 for 50-59–Thanks.”
Mark didn’t write to ask my help in beating the bushes for entrants — although maybe he assumed I did my part by mentioning masters exhibition races in late December.
In any case, check out the application page here.
The real concern here isn’t a few embarrassing open lanes in a showcase event. It’s the fear that masters won’t be invited back to open nationals if we don’t show up in full force.
Mark also raised eyebrows by setting the M50 qualifying standard for the 60 at 7.36 – which was what Bill Collins ran last year and Marty Krulee ran Jan. 19 this year. (But Mark has admitted that this standard was meant specifically to accommodate Bill.)
So we’ll see what happens. Empty lanes are not only a crying shame. They’re also a black eye to masters track.
19 Responses
Ken, we have 4 women’s entries and 3 Men’s entries so far with 6 lanes to fill–I think we will be ok thanks for the concern. I expect to get several more entries this coming week. The deadline for National Masters News was missed by a day and that caused a delay in entries–but athletes can always go to the Masters Invitational webpage, all the events for the year with time standards for qualifying are there–Next up Drake Men’s Mile.
7.36 for 60 meters? Does Bill Collins want to run by himself (or just with Maqrty Krulee)? Why not make the standard more reasonable, like 7.80. 7.80 covers the top 10 50-59 male sprinters during 2007. Maybe more sprinters would be interested with better thought out standard.
Mark, when will we find out which men’s event will be contested at the trials?
Mark, I see, so there is only going to be one heat of 6 of masters men 60 meters, basically 40 to 59 and the cut off point is 7.36 if you are over 50 in the one heat……..
I’m a little surprised that at none of these events has the 400m been available. There are at least eight athletes that would compete anywhere at anytime. It doesn’t make sense to a logical mind and ultimately it doesn’t help our sport when we can’t fill lanes at a Nationally recognized and celebrated event. Its a shame!
By the way I was referring to the men’s 400m.
Tony, maybe a 400m mens at the trials ..that would be a good one ….
The Men’s event that has been submitted for the trials is the 3,000m. An event that has only been contested once in the program and it was an indoor race that had two Men go under the old American record by 9 and 10 seconds.
We have had 400m run a few times in the program and I am sure that it will be run again. Ken Effler, the standard was well thought out–the idea is to have the fastest 6 guys in the field–yes there are only Marty and Bill Collins who have met the standard which gives the top two 50’s a chance to compete.
The program is designed to put the fastest people on the track in most cases that’s the 40’s with a little room for some of the fastest 50’s. The athletes don’t always have a good grasp on what it takes to put this stuff together–In the beginning we attempted to do a race with an older age group and there are several difficulties with that–commitment to travel at one’s own expense is one and the propencity for injury in the older age groups plays a factor, then finally depth of field is a big challenge.
This program was designed to showcase our elite Masters athletes and we have seen it draw former elite open athletes as they see that they have competition in the Masters ranks. The general public gets to see awe inspiring performances by athletes in the Masters program.
Mark
What is the proposed qualifying standard and field size for the Men’s 3000m?
Yeah I thought so as well Sully but it seems not to be something people care to see. I’m a little confused by all this, their seems to be personal issues and crap that makes no sense to me, so I just run. I can tell you this though it definitely doesn’t help our sport in anyway, of that I have no doubt. Sad.
Sorry for misunderstanding the event. I thought there were seperate races for 40-49 and 50-59. I’m sure Bill Collins is up for the challenge, but it doesn’t seem fair to have someone in their latter 50’s go up against folks in their early 40’s.
Tony are you kidding the folks in Eugene and big fans of distance races–but then again I can’t expect a sprinter to think anyone would enjoy anything but a short to long sprint. Ken,no one is forcing anyone to run here–Bill and Marty may or may not run–these guys love competition and although I’m sure they respect the ability of the guys at the top of the performance list they surely don’t fear them and very well may be up for the challenge.
To answer a.b’s question- the proposed field size is up to 16–with the hopes that 12 will actually make the starting line after scratches. The time standard will be about 9:35.
Mark you are right I find distance races boring until the last 100m and at least two competitors are going at it, but I also find sprints boring if someone is winning easily. I also find races I’m in boring if I win easily, but what I don’t find boring is when their is a race with really good competition and I don’t see it in the 3000m. Case in point I along with others athletes have been trying to woo over some European athletes to compete against our mile relay at Penn relays because I think it would it be a great race and bring some attention to Masters Track. Its really all I’m interested in, some great races while I still can do it.
Mark, I have a poster of steve prefontaine on my office wall ….love to watch any race as long as the runners put it all on the line….guts not glory….I aspire to the warron zevon school of track ….I’d rather feel pain than nothing at all so hurl me against the wall…no pain no pleasure…..later, weight room calls……
Tony – Whoa! Personally, I love nothing better than sitting in the stands and watching a group of my masters peers blaze a fast, competitive 400 (damn, wish I could!).
But I have to object to your dismissal of potential 3000 runners as non-competitive. The U.S. has by far the best collection of 3000 runners in the world right now, and Mark could conceivably put together a field including current and former age group American 3000 meter record holders Tony Young, Brian Pope, Danny Martinez, Nolan Shaheed, Rich Burns, and moi – not to mention potential age group 3000 record challengers Jim Sorenson (if he doesn’t qualify for the open 1500 in the Trials), John Hinton (M45 WR in 1500 and Mile), Dennis Simonaitis (American M45 road 10K record holder), Sean Wade (former Olympian), and Patrick Fuller, who could be the fastest of all of us!
My point is that the U.S. is currently loaded with masters distance-running talent, easily the best ever, and it’s silly to suggest that there isn’t the potential for an absolutely amazing lineup.
All that said, we masters distance guys, just like you masters sprint guys, sometimes have a hard time staying injury-free and in top fitness for long periods of time. So there’s no guaranteeing that we’d all be able to run (or run well) in late June/early July. But I’d suggest that the same holds true for your event.
No matter what, I hate seeing these sorts of arguments devolve into a sprinting vs distance running controversy. Because the truth is that I’ve always had the utmost respect (coupled with a dose of envy!) for the sprinters in our spot, and I’ve also felt like some of the best support I’ve gotten as a middle-distance runner has come from those same sprinters!
Frankly, the fact that we compete in the same sport but don’t compete directly against one another seems to foster a particularly high regard for one another – at least it does with me. I’ve got nothing but love for the Gaults, Loftens, Berrys, Chinns, and yes, Echeandias of our sport!
So don’t be dis’ing us 3000 guys just because you’re feeling slighted by the selection process for these events.
And for the record, I’d love to see you 400 guys get the nod for this event. Or the hurdles guys. Or the 100 guys. Or the field guys (man, it’d be a blast to see some of the high jumpers and pole vaulters currently tearing up the record books get together for one of these!).
Later.
Peter no disrespect for you or any other distance runner. it wasn’t my intention to be disrespectful, but when you see that we can’t fill lanes at a open national event that is just foolish management.
I believe these events are suppose to promote Masters Track and field but i get the feeling that no one is really paying attention because the decisions are being made without input form all masters athletes.
I wrote to Mark privately to see about the olympic trials and he answered me, I can understand his logic in having the 3000 at the Olympic trials but I still think it won’t be exciting to watch. It is what it is, but since I have started running again I haven’t seen anything at a national open event that has been exciting or promotional for Masters Track and just for the record I am a 400m Hurdler I run the 400 because I can but i love the hurdles but you don’t see me promoting the 400m hurdles because it would be absolutely ridiculous to watch as an event at a open national championship, its a tough event and we have a tough enough time trying to fill 8 lanes at the masters national championships.
Regardless this is my opinion, drawn from what i have witness so far in Masters Track and field and of course this won’t be my last. I simply say lets see what unfolds from the decisions made by management in these events when they happen.
Anyone that knows anything about sprinters would know that it would be very difficult for a sprinter to justify flying across the country to run one 60M race. Especially in a year when we have a world indoor championships, weeks after the elite nationals and a week before the US Masters indoor championships.
There has been a group of 400 Meter runners that have asked for years to have our event selected with no success. We have always stated that we could fill the field as well as have several alternates show up. I acknowledge that Mark has great challenge in trying to figure out what events to select year to year, but if you have guys coming to you asking for a particular event. Chances are you not going to have a problem filling up the lanes. Just something for all of us involved to think about.
I don’t think any of us want to see this program fail. It is a great opportunity for us to showcase our level of the sport to another part of the track and field world. Let’s not dissappoint them. I do hope that sometime in the near future the 400 and the 200 are selected for the men.
Right now in those events across several of the age groups we have some of the best runners in the world. It would be great to showcase that talent at an event such as this.
Robert, we have had the 400m and the 200m in the past and things will cycle and we will have those events again. Just for your information in regard to filling lanes we have very good fields for the Indoor Nationals and yes some guys will fly in from Atlanta and Ohio and elsewhere to run a 60m event in a World Masters Indoor year.
Also the last time we had a sprint event indoor was the one and only time that we did not fill all the lanes(4 out of 6)I will say in the defense of the middle distance and Distance guys we have great depth and the fields come together quickly because the guys will go anywhere anytime for the best competition.
As far as the program in most cases the Invitational events produce better times that the Nationals do–one reason top competition and no rounds.
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