Seeking solutions to the masters records mess
In pointing out that WMA (and probably USATF) list dozens of plain-wrong age-group records, I got some people thinking. One thoughtful note came from masters meet announcer Pete Taylor. He wrote: “I’m more interested in US records than I am in the world marks.” And another Pete — Pete Mulholland of Running Fitness magazine in the UK — reminded me of the great work done by statmeister Martin Rix in compiling M35 and W35 world bests, which could easily replace many of the WMA records in that youngest group.
Pete Taylor continued:
“For US records we need to do two things:
(1) Incorporate modern technology into the approval process. In practical terms this would mean that some records would become approved almost immediately (the Internet would show the result; the meet would have authenticated the athlete as part of registration and the result through its normal processes).
“(2) Marks from the worlds and the outdoor nationals would be accepted immediately. All marks from the Penn Relays would be accepted automatically, as would all marks from the Hayward Classic, Southeastern Masters, and certain other meets. These meets, as would be the case with the worlds and nationals, would have class A status for records; all other meets would be in class B and would require an application for records (either electronic or paper).
“The worlds and nationals would always have class A status, but there would be periodic review of the other meets to see that they continued to merit this designation.”
I also got a confidential note from a WMA higher-up pointing out that Sandy Pashkin, the new WMA Records czar, inherited an utter disaster (and so “don’t go too hard on her”). It seems that Pete Mundle and Brian Oxley — her predecessors in the job — had let the records go to seed.
No question in the case of Pete Mundle, whose latest single-age world records booklet I ripped to shreds last August. (If his hobby booklet was any indication of his WMA work, no wonder we’re doomed.)
I’m not as clear on what Canadian Brian Oxley did to muck up masters records, but obviously the set of records he left are an embarrassment to the masters movement.
And why am I geting so worked up about WMA records?
I’ll cite one major reason:
Masters track is in jeapordy of becoming a laughingstock. How can anyone take us seriously when we don’t take seriously our own best performances?
And another reason:
If media can’t count on WMA/USATF to list actual rootin’-tootin’ records, how do athletes get the recognition they deserve for being the best — or even know what the best is?
Remember the outcry over Justin Gatlin’s rounded-down 100 record?
Think of what serious track fans would say about an IAAF record list that contained dozens of errors. Unthinkable actually. IAAF wouldn’t last a nanosecond if it posted even a single incorrect mark.
But when WMA lists records that are clearly wrong, we’re supposed to “go easy”?
Not on this blog’s watch.
I don’t have all the answers, but I sure as heck don’t accept the status quo.
Let’s get our heads out of the sand, WMA and USATF. Do something!
9 Responses
In DEFENSE of Sandy Pashkin she certainly was handed a pile of crap in regard to the “records”..there can be NO question about that. Maybe now she might consider returning emails and calls to we athletes that call and write her in regard to what we feel are very important issues?????? I140211 15:49:14 [ERROR] Got error 127 when reading table ‘./lwilson_smartpop/wp_options’
se_shelter/wp_term_relationships.MYI’; try to repair it
140211 15:43:21 [ERROR] /usr/local/libexec/mysqld: Incorrect key file for table ‘./indhouse_shelter/wp_term_relationships.MYI’; try to repair it
140211 15:43:21 [ERROR] /usr/local/libexec/mysqld: Incorrect key file for table ‘./indhouse_shelter/wp_term_taxonomy.MYI’; try to repair it
140211 15:43:21 [ERROR] /usr/local/libexec/mysqld: Incorrect key file for table ‘./indhouse_shelter/wp_term_taxonomy.MYI’; try to repair it
d!! Great system we have here..an error is even recognized but NOT corrected….keep up the great work.
Here we go again with the same old bull —- Francis is 100% correct. He is not the only one who has tried to get his teamates records in the books. As he puts it in regards to past records. He was brushed off as if these races never existed! For that matter so were many more I would venture to guess.
My teamate and friend Ed Small set a World Record at the Indoor National for 500 yds at West Point,N.Y. in 1982 That W.R. never ever saw the pages of any record book.
How come the World Record set in P.R. 4 X 100 50 Year old team is not in the books . That is simply unjustified. I am sure and we all know who the four great runners on that relay team were. I am sure they feel the same way.
Also This is for you “Pete Taylor
‘ being you mentioned A.R. In the 1988 Outdoor Nationals Winter Park 8/4/88 300 I.H 43.16 American Record 50 -54 age group will never be listed because as Sandy Pashkin personally told me to my face and via e-mail they no longer contest that event for record purposes in that age group and that only current events are accepted.
So that means that all the long hours of training to reach our goals and that goes for Ed Small, Ed Gonera, Jesse Norman, Frank Bowen. Francis Schiro,and all the other atheletes all over the U.S.A.are for naught ! Need I say more ?
Rich Rizzo
I guess I must be “special” because Sandy Pashkin responded very quickly to my email query re the lack of world record marks from the Nat Masters Meet in Boston. She also noted that both she and George Mathews were frustrated by the lack of response from the USATF-NE office. So I am not complaining about her responsiveness or lack there of on that score.
As mentioned by others, Sandy has inherited a mess and I am sure she is frustrated as all get out over trying to clean up the crap. That she does not respond to each and every email concerning this or that record – well- cut her some slack folks. That being said, it certainly does not help the situation that National Masters News publishes a rumor as fact – ie that the mile had been eliminated as a world record, and also some relay records, when in fact this had not happened. I did see a box at the bottom of one inside page in the latest edition noting that mile records had been in Boston. No apology -no mention that they printed a rumor, just a box notice on the bottom of an inside page.
I doubt that even Sandy can clean up the records to the satisfaction of those who feel agrieved. However she is a smart woman and appears to be at home with modern technology so perhaps she can use her influence to get the “paper shuffle” shifted to some sort of electronic process. The current mess reminds me of my doctor’s office, most of the visit is spend shuffling papers, wondering about prior test results, looking for current ones, suggestion tests be done that have been done, etc. it is a mess, and if that office were not now in the midst of switching to a computerized system- I would be doctor shopping.
Meanwhile – we have nowhere else to turn – we cannot shop for another venue for record keeping, all we can do is to urge modernization of our “leaders’, to continue to complain, to offer positive suggestions, and to be helpful to Sandy has she tries to clean up the disaster.
WOW Mary..”cut her some slack”???? In regard to YOUR records or mine??????? My suggestion that Sandy answer LETTERS(certified…second day mail) and emails IS a positive suggestion.
With very few ventures into the record books until recently, I am just beginning to understand how difficult the certification and documentation can be for these “official records”. I would like to thank Nadine O’Conner and Kathy Bergen for immediately handing me copies of the necessary forms less than a minute after I broke the record. Without their help, what was a very exciting moment in my life would most certainly have ended in frustration. I will follow their lead and carry copies of the form for anyone who is fortunate enough to need them.
Mary you are not special at all . Frank & I are not talking about Boston records !! They will be in the record books . WAKE UP GIRL !! I am talking about all the athletes that have been around for 30 years or more working their asses off to the extreme to be the best they can . Finally they achieve W.R. or A.R. with times that you probably only dream of and they dont get thier names in the record books . Your name is in the books so you dont have to worry about what we are doing in order to get the recognition that all who are in the record books have!!
So smarten up and if you don’t know what you are talking about keep your mouth closed and your fingers off the keyboard. . I will be at the Nationals and if you want to confront me on this comment just ask for Rich Rizzo I will be more than glad to express my feelings to you personally regarding this matter.
Rich Rizzo
N.Y.
Richie….please dont take your anger and frustration out on Mary..she is totally “one of us”. She always speaks her mind and thats a GOOD thing. We who have been cheated have to keep focus on the real issues. They (the REAL issues)are CONSTANTLY and skillfully ignored…Ken Stone said it right..”a buch of crap”. When guys like yourself and Ed Small TRUE TRACK and FIELD athletes ..involved in our sports for many many years get cheated and disrespected it makes me VERY upset as well. Mary is a great athlete and was not saying anything against all of us who have been cheated by the existing pathetic “record system”.Mary PLEASE keep your fingers ON the keyboard..WE need you.. Francis A Schiro
Richie….please dont take your anger and frustration out on Mary..she is totally “one of us”. She always speaks her mind and thats a GOOD thing. We who have been cheated have to keep focus on the real issues. They (the REAL issues)are CONSTANTLY and skillfully ignored…Ken Stone said it right..”a bunch of crap”. When guys like yourself and Ed Small TRUE TRACK and FIELD athletes ..involved in our sports for many many years get cheated and disrespected it makes me VERY upset as well. Mary is a great athlete and was not saying anything against all of us who have been cheated by the existing pathetic “record system”.Mary PLEASE keep your fingers ON the keyboard..WE need you.. Francis A Schiro
Mary…. Francis is right and I apologize to you for the comment I made on this blog.
Leave a Reply